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The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

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Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#511

Post by StanislavPetrov »

astrange wrote: post #496
StanislavPetrov wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unemployment benefits ended long ago, but working people have continued to suffer. People who were forced to quarantine and miss work due to government mandates don't get unemployment. Unemployment is no replacement for the millions of people who saw their children's schools shuttered for a year (or two!!) and were forced to quit their jobs and stay home to take care of their children. Food, energy, rent, health insu…

> People who were forced to quarantine and miss work due to government mandates don't get unemployment. Yes they did. PUA made them qualify too. Or if they didn't lose their job, there was PPP and child tax credits. > Trillions that ended up in the pockets of the country's wealthiest people, who saw their net wealth double or triple during the pandemic and corporate profits soar while working people fell further unde…

>It looks like their wealth went up if you measure starting from March 2020 when there was a stock market collapse, sure, but poor people's wealth went up and their income has gone up significantly with pay raises since.

Poor people don't have "wealth". Most lived paycheck to paycheck before the pandemic hit and they lost their jobs and were forced to stay home and take care of their children. The ones lucky enough to keep their jobs didn't have their salaries increase nearly as much as inflation, which massively eroded their ability to afford even food and other basic necessities. As cited above, the world's richest people doubled and tripled their net worth during this period. Millions of working people face eviction and homelessness, today, after the recent expiration of eviction moratoriums. Its simply a willful denial of reality to reject these easily checked facts.

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#512

Post by astrange »

StanislavPetrov wrote: post #511
astrange wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People who were forced to quarantine and miss work due to government mandates don't get unemployment. Yes they did. PUA made them qualify too. Or if they didn't lose their job, there was PPP and child tax credits. > Trillions that ended up in the pockets of the country's wealthiest people, who saw their net wealth double or triple during the pandemic and corporate profits soar while working people fell further unde…

>It looks like their wealth went up if you measure starting from March 2020 when there was a stock market collapse, sure, but poor people's wealth went up and their income has gone up significantly with pay raises since. Poor people don't have "wealth". Most lived paycheck to paycheck before the pandemic hit and they lost their jobs and were forced to stay home and take care of their children. The ones lucky enough t…

> Most lived paycheck to paycheck before the pandemic hit and they lost their jobs and were forced to stay home and take care of their children.

Where they got more than $2400/mo in stimulus, and CTC continued until this year. It's certainly bad that expired, but there's time to renew it.

> The ones lucky enough to keep their jobs didn't have their salaries increase nearly as much as inflation, which massively eroded their ability to afford even food and other basic necessities.

No they didn't, poor people's pay raises were better than inflation. It's the middle class who are down - but that number is largely because consumption shifted from services to goods (since people stopped being able to travel/don't want to go to restaurants). If you decompose it, it still looks like the largest increases are transitory.

> Millions of working people face eviction and homelessness, today, after the recent expiration of eviction moratoriums.

They expired three times in the last 3 years. Each time there were news articles saying it would be a huge problem, and each time it wasn't (thankfully). That's because we managed it quietly at smaller scales.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-18/u-s-evict...

https://www.penncapital-star.com/commentary/that-tidal-wave-...

Current numbers are up a bit, but not explosively so: https://evictionlab.org/eviction-tracking/

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#513

Post by iso1631 »

jtbayly wrote: post #408
iso1631 wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US tax brackets seem to be https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/irs-provides-tax-inflation-adju...

That shows nothing about the amount of the adjustment. Looking up last year's and running a few calculations, it appears to have been adjusted 1%! That's not adjusting for inflation. Not sure what it's adjusting for, but not inflation.

Headline literally says

IRS provides tax inflation adjustments

And links to https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/rp-20-45.pdf

"This revenue procedure sets forth inflation-adjusted items for 2021 for various provisions of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 (Code)"

It's states adjusting for inflation for the tax year beginning March 2021. The document came out in October 2020 when inflation was 1.2%, I'm not sure when they adjust it and you may disagree with the measure of inflation

The year before was November 2019

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/rp-19-44.pdf

Here's the one for 2021/2 (Nov 29th 2021)

https://www.irs.gov/irb/2021-48_IRB

Married Individuals Filing Joint Returns, lowest and highest bands:

Thresholds for tax year 2021/2 goes from 19750 to 19900 (0.7%) at one end, and from 622050 to 628300 at the other (1%)

Thresholds for tax year 2022/3 goes from 19900 to 20550 (3.27%) at one end, and from 628300 to 647850 at the other (3.11%)

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#514

Post by carapace »

curiousllama wrote: post #497
carapace wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I said "products". Service industries with razor-thin margins like restaurants are more affected by labor costs, sure.

To be fair, service industries are the most likely to pay low wages

I'd say that a service industry that can't pay workers (primary producers of the service, that can't be replaced) a "living wage" is exploitative and should probably be reworked or disbanded.

Do we want to be cooked for and served by folks who can't make ends meet? Do we want our kids taught by folks who can't afford to buy a home?

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#515

Post by whiplash451 »

fishtacos wrote: post #121
whiplash451 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. The Economist had a great article about this in their Dec 2011 edition. The article is behind a paywall, but the gist of it is that two effects explain the uptick in people changing jobs: (1) surges of job demand in new sectors boosted or entirely created by the pandemic (2) people who postponed job changes in 2020 (which hopefully will be considered as the worse year of the pandemic), effectively creating a…

Dec 2021* - 2011 changes the entire meaning of your post.

2021, definitely :) Apologies for the typo.

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#516

Post by Salgat »

gruez wrote: post #489
Salgat wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My take on /r/antiwork is that people not working is the end goal, which is the hope for a true futuristic utopia right? Obviously we can't reach that yet, so people compromise by wanting better working conditions in the meantime.

Kind of like how the people in the soviet union were working towards a true communist utopia?

Soviet Union was a brutal dictatorship with an elite class operating under the guise of communism. Same goes for any notions of it being socialist. Under no circumstance was the means of production owned by the workers in the USSR. Also most folks pushing for socialism are pushing for Social Democracy.

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#517

Post by jjeaff »

oriki wrote: post #292
jjeaff wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think two of the biggest falsehoods many people seem to believe about finances is that one, you don't want to move up in tax brackets because then you will suddenly be making less money. And two, that somehow businesses and business owners can just "write off" expenses so that those expenses don't actually cost them any money. There are a few edge cases where these can be technically true but they are rare and limi…

I think you are misreading the comment at the root of this whole thread. They aren't saying "if you go up a tax bracket, ALL of your income goes down because you pay more taxes!" but instead saying "you might make more money but despite that, you will not be able to buy more things." I don't think tax brackets have anything to do with this besides being tied to how much you make.

>you might make more money but despite that, you will not be able to buy more things.

I'm not sure how else to read that. If you make more money, you can buy more things. Even if you go up a tax bracket. If you make twice as much money and that moves you up a tax bracket, you won't be able to buy twice as many things, but you can still by more things than you could when you made half as much. Maybe 1.8 times more things.

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#518

Post by rsanek »

carapace wrote: post #484
rsanek wrote: post #475

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? In particular for restaurants and other businesses that rely on service jobs, I've typically read the opposite.

I said "products". Service industries with razor-thin margins like restaurants are more affected by labor costs, sure.

Would still love to see a source if you have one!

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#519

Post by carapace »

rsanek wrote: post #518
carapace wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I said "products". Service industries with razor-thin margins like restaurants are more affected by labor costs, sure.

Would still love to see a source if you have one!

I'd love to, but my search fu has failed me this morning. (All I could find were corporate blogspam and investopedia definitions and such.)

To be perfectly frank with you, I was just talking out my behind above. I view economists as the modern equivalent of court astrologers, and having no respect for their "science", I feel no need to honor it or refer to its conclusions. I believe that econ papers say whatever the person paying for them wants to hear, so I personally don't see any point in referring to them.

Sorry for trolling.

Re: The Great Resignation? More Like the Great Renegotiation

#520

Post by elAhmo »

sleepingadmin wrote: post #262

Why is the central bank inflation target typically 2%? Well if you target 0% and any actual result below 0% happens, that's deflation which is a disaster for economies. If inflation is say 10%. Maximum employment is near certainly impossible. Debt will be expensive and the economy crawls to a halt. Who wants to pay 10% interest on their student debt? So where in between do you have a good price stability? It tends to…

Where does 115% come from?
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