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Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

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Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#781

Post by umvi »

sib301 wrote: post #363
skillpass wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree - I am worried about taking hospital capacity claims at face value though. From what I've seen, it was common for hospitals to report being overwhelmed even during flu seasons pre-covid. I wouldn't classify that level of 'overwhelmed' worthy of mandates upon society. I don't doubt that during these periods of time hospital resources are strained in some way, but there's a difference between this routine level…

Dude go to a hospital in a populated area during this surge. My wife sat in the waiting room for 3 hours with SEVERE abdominal pain, DURING A PREGNANCY and was unable to be seen. We went home. If she’d had an ectopic pregnancy, she would probably not be here anymore.

Busy ERs are not unique to covid. I've had many experiences with multi-hour ER waits pre-2020

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#782

Post by rcpt »

eloff wrote: post #631
nu11ptr wrote: post #571

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apologies in advance for getting on my soapbox, but this has been on my mind for a while. The way in which the media has gotten everyone to say "the unvaccinated" is a 'disease' against basic science (not even getting into the divisive nature of this). I would go as far as saying if you read any paper, study, or other that refers to the "unvaccinated" as a single cohort, you are reading vaccine propaganda, not scienc…

I've also noticed this. I have covid right now. I'm double vaccinated. I was planning to get my booster shot, but now that I've had covid what's the point. It's not likely to increase my immunity and it comes with risks. At some point the government will probably change the definition of fully vaccinated to three shots and then I'll be in that unvaccinated group I usually make fun of. Somebody I know lost their job b…

The mRNA vaccines were developed in February 2020. The virus has had ample opportunity to change since then so it's not surprising that you still got sick.

I don't think it makes sense to extrapolate this to a hypothetical new shot which is developed for the new virus.

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#783

Post by SheepSlapper »

josefx wrote: post #214
ouchjars wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you could avoid getting obese with two shots in the arm and wearing a piece of cloth every time you leave the house for a couple years.

Quoted post unavailable.

It's been a while since this was a "covid countermeasure", but how about food curfews! Government mandated intermittent fasting between the hours of 8pm and 8am :)

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#784

Post by lilsoso »

AshleyGrant wrote: post #743
ipaddr wrote: post #695

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Inflammation, memory loss, swollen lymph, chest pains, feeling sicks for months, no energy, trouble breathing. You thought the vaccines were risk free?

The ability for humans to focus on a vanishingly small risk of side-effects to justify taking a much larger risk by refusing to vaccinate is mind-boggling to me. It's the same argument that people use to justify not wearing a seat belt. "There's types of wrecks where being unbelted is actually safer!" Well, sure, but those are an extremely tiny portion of wrecks, and you're vastly safer in the vast, vast majority of…

For young males, the risk of myocarditis strikes me as underappreciated. To quote the NYT (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/09/health/researchers-find-a...):

"Males between 16 and 29 years of age have an increased risk of developing heart problems after receiving a second dose of coronavirus vaccines made by Pfizer-BioNtech or Moderna, according to a large new analysis published on Wednesday in the New England Journal of Medicine.

The study, conducted in Israel, estimated that nearly 11 of every 100,000 males in that age group developed myocarditis, inflammation of the heart, a few days after having been fully vaccinated."

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#785

Post by rcpt »

tjr225 wrote: post #118
gibspaulding wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It has killed more than 865,000 Americans It looks like that's more Americans than have been killed in combat in all of the wars of the 20th century combined [1] Granted it's less than the UK lost in WW1 alone, so it's perhaps more a testament to how few the US managed to loose in the world wars (compared to Europe), but it's still wild to realize. [1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/1009819/total-us-militar...

I know this is going to sound conspiratorial but I think you’d have to be pretty naive to accept the reported deaths in the US due to Covid to be that accurate. Hospitals(which in the US are for profit mind you) were quite literally given more money for reporting a death as a Covid death for a period of time. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/04/24/fac... Actually you could say it’s difficult to trus…

You're right that does sound conspiratorial

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#786

Post by cguess »

AshleyGrant wrote: post #758
autokad wrote: post #732

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my first 2 shots were fine, but my booster f'ed me up. I was in lots of body pain for 36 hours. 5 weeks later I caught omicron. I imagine by some point this year Ill be considered not fully vaccinated, but right now my desire to get another booster is very small. right now we know that even the booster provides little ability to stop you from getting omicron. likely by the next mandated booster the variant of the tim…

> right now we know that even the booster provides little ability to stop you from getting omicron This is true, but the data is showing that being boosted means that catching Omicron when boosted means you are much, much more likely to have a very minor illness. Refusing future boosters comes at the risk of your own health, as well as the health of the people around you.

I'm fully boosted, sat directly across from a friend in a bar booth for over an hour last weekend (figure about 2.5 feet/80cm). She tested positive the next days. I tested negative with PCR twice in the last week however. If was unboosted, much less unvaccinated, I'm 100% sure I'd be positive.

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#787

Post by [deleted] »

azakai wrote: post #556
spookthesunset wrote: post #547

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, then instead of punishing the general public, how about they go build more capacity? They've had 2 years at this point and they are still freaking out about "overflowing hospitals". It's not fair, ethical or moral to push mandates on citizens at this point.

It takes a long time to train doctors and nurses and other relevant staff. Worse, the hard working conditions those people have been enduring since 2020 has led to a lot of burnout and attrition.

[deleted]

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#788

Post by Daishiman »

eggy wrote: post #327
smnrchrds wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's also why many governments do not accept proof of recovery in lieu of proof of vaccination. Those who do have vaccine-skeptic people catching the virus intentionally and risking death. https://globalnews.ca/news/8524409/hana-horka-czech-singer-c...

So there playing the I am ignoring it or lying about it for your benefit card like Fauci about masks early on? It was a while ago that the CDC estimated recovered COVID numbers to bre around 146 million. It is more like over 200 million at this point with overlap of vaccinated people. I am sick of being ignored of having recovered, and people making the excuse that if they let us know how good natural immunity is, or…

The difference is that I can't catch diabetes or obesity from others.

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#789

Post by nu11ptr »

djmips wrote: post #629
nu11ptr wrote: post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment could not illustrate my point better if you had tried

It doesn't illustrate your point. You, on your soapbox pretend you have it all figured out. You, on the side of science. But as some of the responses have shown, you haven't really thought it through. I agree however, that the media hasn't either. But when was that ever true?

First, apologies for slight snugness of that that reply - probably not needed, and I've received some probably well deserved downvotes for that.

Second, it does prove my point in that the poster referred to the "unvaccinated" as a single group, a position that I'm suggesting results in a very inaccurate set of conclusions (which other responders have commented on) because of skewed cohorts.

Third, I most definitely do NOT have it all figured out - I'm as confused as anybody else on most of this stuff, which is why my post was on a single focused point, and not on issues where I have an opinion, but much less research and data supporting my position.

Lastly, I've read all the replies and thought it was good discussion. I didn't see anything to suggest I hadn't thought it through or disprove my position, just disagreements on how useful it would or wouldn't be, which is fair.

Re: Pfizer board member suggests end to mask, vaccine mandates

#790

Post by chipotle_coyote »

ballenf wrote: post #745
onefuncman wrote: post #660

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This didn't happen all of a sudden in Sept 2021. The flu vaccine has always been about harm reduction and began seeing widespread civilian use in 2007-2008.

Maybe it's just where I live, but I've never heard the "flu shot" called a vaccine.

The CDC calls them "Seasonal Flu Vaccines":

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/flushot.htm

So does the Mayo Clinic:

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/flushot.htm

I won't go on, but by definition, a medicine that you take that's intended to build up your immune response to a disease is a vaccine. I saw someone upstream write "Intramuscular/serum vaccines cannot stop respiratory infections, by definition," and as far as I can tell this is just point-blank wrong. Whooping Cough -- pertussis -- is a respiratory bacterial infection we've been vaccinating against with intramuscular shots since the 1940s.

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