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Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

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Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#41

Post by redisman »

OrvalWintermute wrote: post #33
onphonenow wrote: post #9

One problem I am having is that on the left I thought things were pretty high quality from a facts / science side, and that has eroded. Fair disclosure - I'm a max dem donor and will likely continue to vote 100% dem. 7,000 (!) scientists have signed the John Snow memorandum. It states that "Furthermore, there is no evidence for lasting protective immunity to SARS-CoV-2 following natural infection". https://www.johnsn…

> then says masks don't help Actually, they said this: Masks don't help Masks do help, but save them for the healthcare workers Masks do help, get one, a cloth one is fine. Masks do help, double-mask Mask do help, but you need N95 masks Given that even with a properly fitting N95 mask that is form fitting you can still smell everything right through it, I think a properly fit, and negative pressure tested N100 or P10…

A mask someone could wear for hours will never block all smells. Even in a N99 you still smell gases and other small things

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#42

Post by zipswitch »

>we allow people to sound what alarms they want and patrons to decide for themselves what to pay attention to

I think the above alteration throws the dilemma into a little sharper relief.

We live in a complex society which requires a degree of deference to "expert authority" in order to function. Our collective ability to agree on how to determine who (or what) qualifies as such an authority is not working well. I do not have any answers in which I am confident, just Socrates line on the beginning of wisdom.

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#43

Post by krainboltgreene »

So many of these threads are now filled with more than the normal "a company made me take something down because it violated TOS" and now has a cavalcade of conspiracy theories.

The tech community certainly wasn't immune to the craziness of the times.

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#44

Post by romseb »

AussieWog93 wrote: post #38

Reading the comments here, I get the impression that a lot of folks view censorship as a tool of oppression by those in power and free speech as the shield against it. If the past 10 years have taught us anything, it's that both "free speech" and censorship can be weaponised by those in power who wish to manipulate the discourse for their own personal gain. If we want regular folks to have a greater say in public dis…

Can you elaborate on how free speech has been weaponised by those in power?

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#45

Post by Liquix »

Could increased censorship actually be making the misinformation problem worse?

If we are allowed to discuss and compare the merits of various theories, the wheat of truth naturally separates from the chaff of nonsense. When everything outside of The Approved Narrative is censored, people inevitably stumble across "banned" ideas - but there's no one to argue the other side or point out the flaws, making it far too easy to get sucked in.

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#46

Post by systemvoltage »

geekpowa wrote: post #29
tick_tock_tick wrote: post #3

The problem is the government and traditional media have been caught lying again and again. Once that trust is broken I don't know how you rebuild it. Hell people I commonly talk to still believe a police officer was beaten to death on 1/6 and that people, other then the women shot for trying to enter the chambers, died directly due to the riot. All because of that what the news reported and quietly fixed days later…

I search "Jan 6 Deaths" and very first hit is this NYT article. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/05/us/politics/jan-6-capitol... The article contradicts your claim "reported and quietly fixed days later without ever really owning up to it". Firstly it is the first hit so hardly quiet. Secondly it outlines that initial reporting of Sicknick's death was simply reporting what capital police said, later revised by medical…

I am just learning this. I thought all deaths were due to rioters and knew about Ashley's death when she was fatally shot. I read liberal media, all day, everyday - subscribed to WaPo and NYT.

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#47

Post by paulpauper »

As bad as twitter and Facebook censorship is, it's worse for other sites, like Reddit or probably any v-bulletin forum. Reddit subs have soooo much moderation, especially any sub that that is even slightly popular, so many arbitrary and hidden rules and content guidelines. On twitter I can call someone a jerk and the worst that may happen is the person may block me, but that will get your banned from many reddit subs.

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#48

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

umvi wrote: post #27
SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, how is this a left/right issue? The actions you describe the CDC having undertaken were under a right wing government. I don't know how you're making this a political divide issue.

He's not pointing fingers at the other party, he's saying his trust in his own party has eroded.

I'm not saying they are pointing fingers, I'm asking how is this evidence of his own party being a problem so as to cause distrust?

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#49

Post by ksdale »

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #18
hn_version_0023 wrote: post #12

We don’t have a trust problem. We have a lack of trustworthy people in positions of power problem. I see how one can be easily confused. But we (the People) don’t trust politicians or business leaders because they have show repeatedly they’re not worthy of trust.

You could argue that one begets the other. I am not going to argue chicken an egg, but US has generally been very anti-government. If you poll Americans about their representatives, the responses are uniformly negative. And yet, we keep re-electing them in massive numbers. It is absolutely fascinating.

I was under the impression that Americans overwhelmingly disapprove of Congress as a whole, but the individual representatives are about as popular as you'd expect.

Re: Society has a trust problem. More censorship will only make it worse

#50

Post by omgitsabird »

Who is being censored? Sure people are banned from communities, but that is nothing new.

For most people, to host a blog, one can host a server at their house, through their own ISP, use the latest static website package, and share some links. It is a very low barrier to entry.

I think what people are actually saying is that they want the followers that these platforms provide them. They want to be able to push notifications and invade peoples' inboxes. They want entry into their day-to-day. You can't get that from your own host.

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