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Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

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Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#121

Post by frozenport »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #65
dilawar wrote: post #7

https://blog.joss.theoj.org/2019/06/cost-models-for-running-... "The Journal of Open Source Software (JOSS) is a free, open-access online journal, with no article processing charge (APC). We are committed to operating as a free service to our community, and we do so thanks to the volunteer labor of editors and reviewers, and by taking advantage of existing infrastructure. In this post, we examine the true costs of ru…

PNAS, in case anyone is not aware, is the journal where members of the Academy of Sciences publish research they can't publish anywhere else for various reasons. It's a dumping ground for PIs desperate to get something published.

Proceedings Not Accepted by Science

But it does require a "hook up" which tends to screen out the low IF 3 quality stuff

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#122

Post by Nemo_bis »

errcorrectcode wrote: post #89

Might I suggest a co-op, nonprofit journal publisher run for the benefit of multiple institutions that give access at near overall amortized cost and free access to individuals. Corporate greed in healthcare, utilities, government, and academia are Swords of Damocles waiting to happen.

See: http://oad.simmons.edu/oadwiki/OA_journals_published_by_libr...

Also: https://www.openlibhums.org/site/about/

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#123

Post by einpoklum »

cblconfederate wrote: post #119
cossatot wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nature pays their editors, unlike most society journals. But they are a for-profit business, and are clearly just looking for more profit. The expected lifetime value of any article in Nature Neuroscience for the authors is well above $11,390, as that is probably 1% of the typical grant that will produce the article, and getting published in this venue makes it much easier to continue to get grants funded, to get top…

To be clear: they pay their own editors, the ones who do the coordination, not the authors (who actually edit the paper) or the reviewers. 11000 is the annual pay of a Phd student in southern europe, it's incredibly high amount. the $5000 that elsevier asks is already enough. prestigious EU grants run for > $1m. National grants may be $100000. As an EU citizen i hate the fact that even more EU money is siphoned to en…

> 11000 is the paycheck of a Phd student in southern europe,

A Ph.D. candidate (don't call them students please, they're researchers more than students) in southern Europe does _not_ get 11,000 USD / month. Something between 2,000 and 4,500 AFAICT.

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#124

Post by einpoklum »

dibujante wrote: post #64
jrockway wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure there is any requirement that your price be based on the cost of your bill of materials. Would shut down a lot of companies that are like "$30,000 per year for SSO". It probably costs them less to let you log in with Google than it does to store your password hashes, and yet it's always the "no, you have to pay us more" option. The thing with these journals is that they have name recognition that makes…

In a well-functioning market, the price of goods should eventually shrink to their cost of production. If they do not, that's a monopoly.

1. There is no such thing as a "well-functioning market", that's an ideological construct.

2. In a market of commodities, prices are determined by multiple aspects of the surrounding social power relations.

3. In a market, there tends to be a concentration of capital leading to an oligopoly or monopoly; this is more likely than a shrinking of prices to the cost of production.

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#126

Post by dariosalvi78 »

einpoklum wrote: post #123
cblconfederate wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be clear: they pay their own editors, the ones who do the coordination, not the authors (who actually edit the paper) or the reviewers. 11000 is the annual pay of a Phd student in southern europe, it's incredibly high amount. the $5000 that elsevier asks is already enough. prestigious EU grants run for > $1m. National grants may be $100000. As an EU citizen i hate the fact that even more EU money is siphoned to en…

> 11000 is the paycheck of a Phd student in southern europe, A Ph.D. candidate (don't call them students please, they're researchers more than students) in southern Europe does _not_ get 11,000 USD / month. Something between 2,000 and 4,500 AFAICT.

he meant per year...

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#127

Post by cheonic8492 »

lultimouomo wrote: post #120
cossatot wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nature pays their editors, unlike most society journals. But they are a for-profit business, and are clearly just looking for more profit. The expected lifetime value of any article in Nature Neuroscience for the authors is well above $11,390, as that is probably 1% of the typical grant that will produce the article, and getting published in this venue makes it much easier to continue to get grants funded, to get top…

> The expected lifetime value of any article in Nature Neuroscience for the authors is well above $11,390 This. Authors are the customers of the journals; the service they are buying is a push towards tenure and more funding. This has been true for a long time; open access only makes it more explicit. When readers are the ones paying, you can argue that they are paying the journal so that it makes sure that they are…

> I think journals are now in a situation similar to the one of rating agencies and accounting firms. I don't think it will work out very well.

Students aren’t paying for college, the government is.

The researchers aren’t paying Nature, the government is.

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#128

Post by michaelerule »

frayesto wrote: post #2

Not sure what other people do, but I always publish at a journal then put my manuscript on arxiv, or whatever field equivalent, and then on my personal website. Then I submit it to scihub. Best we can do these days

How do you submit your papers to scihub?

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#129

Post by kragen »

mnd999 wrote: post #117
kragen wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the ACM should support young and female researchers by making all their papers open access, publicly endorsing Sci-hub, and committing to send Sci-hub some money every month. That would have a much bigger impact than scholarships and workshops.

I mean sure, making papers by underrepresented groups open access to increase their reach is actually a nice idea. Not sure what this has to do with sci-hub though, publishers are not going to fund sci-hub in the same way that the RIAA is not going to fund the pirate bay.

I don't mean they should make papers by underrepresented groups open access. I mean they should make the papers researchers need to read open access so that access to those papers isn't conditional on getting into a rich university, thus reducing the barriers to underrepresented groups and everyone else. By "their papers" I meant "the ACM's papers", not "the papers of young and female researchers".

It's extremely unfortunate that the ACM has been degraded into being a "publisher" rather than a learned society, and I agree that as long as they think of themselves that way, they will continue to obstruct progress and reproduce patterns of social and economic inequality in the way they are currently doing.

Re: Nature Neuroscience offers open access publishing for $11k per article

#130

Post by kenich »

einpoklum wrote: post #123
cblconfederate wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be clear: they pay their own editors, the ones who do the coordination, not the authors (who actually edit the paper) or the reviewers. 11000 is the annual pay of a Phd student in southern europe, it's incredibly high amount. the $5000 that elsevier asks is already enough. prestigious EU grants run for > $1m. National grants may be $100000. As an EU citizen i hate the fact that even more EU money is siphoned to en…

> 11000 is the paycheck of a Phd student in southern europe, A Ph.D. candidate (don't call them students please, they're researchers more than students) in southern Europe does _not_ get 11,000 USD / month. Something between 2,000 and 4,500 AFAICT.

Sounds about right as an annual figure. My annual stipend in London was ~£16,000 and the cost of living there is commensurately higher than in southern Europe.
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