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The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

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141–150 of 409 posts

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#141
post #42

I sure hope that's right. It was the best feeling in the world to stand up an Apache server on my Amiga, and later my little FreeBSD server, and see my friends viewing the website I was hosting on my dialup connection. It wasn't pretty, it wasn't elegant, and it certainly wasn't fast, but it was mine . I made that. From installing the server to writing the HTML, I owned that service from end to end and had completely…

The thing that is missing in the DIY website space is discoverability. Fix that, and you might have a chance of competing with big corporations. (In the old days we had "web rings", but I'm afraid that's not going to work today)

I think it’s all missing forums, places (both public and private) where people from different “home servers” can communicate.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#142
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got bored the other day and thought it would be funny to make a copy of the most expensive NFT and set that as my Twitter profile picture because they added that silly feature. So I downloaded MetaMask, got everything set up, and went to one of the NFT marketplaces to try to make one. Uploaded the image and got a big scary warning: > (paraphrased; I don't have a screenshot) This image was found too many times on th…

> Using crypto to sign transactions to verify my identity is actually a very interesting idea, I like it a lot. Much easier than creating a user/pass for every site- just click Sign and go. That's basically the only good UX of web3 as it stands. We already have this with SSO though - what would be the difference? Decentralization? Though it should be possible to host your own SSO.

Right, and if you don't want a single trackable identity, which lots of people don't, a nice modern phone can also WebAuthn using say a fingerprint reader† and so you can have one step sign in (tap sensor, sign in) that way with the resulting "identity" living only on that one site.

† You might be thinking wait, we don't want to be trackable. WebAuthn doesn't have any way of sending fingerprints to anywhere, the phone is using the biometrics to make this not work for bag snatcher, or for the guy snooping your desk while you go get a coffee.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#143
post #67

I sure hope that's right. It was the best feeling in the world to stand up an Apache server on my Amiga, and later my little FreeBSD server, and see my friends viewing the website I was hosting on my dialup connection. It wasn't pretty, it wasn't elegant, and it certainly wasn't fast, but it was mine . I made that. From installing the server to writing the HTML, I owned that service from end to end and had completely…

The barrier of entry was actually lower than that. We didn't need to stand up an Apache server. We could just sign up for a Geocities/Xoom/Tripod account and upload HTML or use the built in site editor to create content. Somewhere along the way, people stopped building well organized sites and started producing chronologically organized writings and content. These chronologically organized articles and content have d…

Yeah, I found it weird that the article called blogs "Web 1.0", I'm pretty sure that it was them that were first hailed as the new "Web 2.0" ?

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#144
post #32

I feel like this article doesn't address the reason why people moved away from the "old" Internet --- most people only care about their _content_ not the particular technology that backs it. In the old times, you could only host content if you were really good with the technology. The people who had websites were people who knew how to set up and run a web server, and to compose the HTML content that was being served…

And I think the heart of it is that most people working in this space want that. They want the niche back.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#145
post #30

> 'Some people use the term "Web 3.0" to refer only to decentralized blockchain-based networks without considering that all personal websites have essentially the same goals, be they on the regular Internet or on the new blockchain networks. Those who use the term "web 3.0" seem to have forgotten that self-hosted personal websites that run on home servers and are accessible over the regular Internet are inherently de…

It's worth noting that there is a core of people doing real work in crypto who are not trying to peddle NFTs or other sleight of hand rungpulls designed to separate the gullible from their money. Ethereum, for example, is full of people building interesting things like off-chain low-cost trading using non-interactive zero knowledge proofs and actively working to make crypto less energy intensive and more useful. They…

> There are plenty of examples of people doing this important work because they legitimately believe that a world where fiat control is divorced from the levers of governmental power is a positive change.

Regardless of their intentions this is a bad idea and deserves every line of criticism it receives.

Governance, law, and financial regulation exist for reasons that programmers have no place or reason to replace.

Wether they wish it or not there is a centralization of authority that will happen. In Ethereum’s case either the oligarchs with the most money will set the rules, or more likely, actual governments with armies and the ability to enforce laws will.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#146
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing that is missing in the DIY website space is discoverability. Fix that, and you might have a chance of competing with big corporations. (In the old days we had "web rings", but I'm afraid that's not going to work today)

Why not, with web-rings? I don't mean that snarkily: I have at least 2-3 webrings on my personal link page, and neocities is home to literally hundreds more.

Web-rings are linked lists, slow to navigate. Google gives you hashtable access to the web.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same, although I'm no longer doing what you're doing. With today's average bandwidth usage, I don't know why an ISP would seriously give a crap about someone hosting an HTTP server on their home IP unless it was dealing with some insane amount of traffic.

since they want to sell the more expensive business plan. And forbidding something in the terms makes it easy for them to cancel your account in case they have a different reason.

We make people pay for a business account and extra on top to get a static ip. The amount of support from people that know just enough to think they need to do home hosting is a multiple more than a typical home user.

The people that actually know what they are doing have to pay more but I never hear from them.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#148

I sure hope that's right. It was the best feeling in the world to stand up an Apache server on my Amiga, and later my little FreeBSD server, and see my friends viewing the website I was hosting on my dialup connection. It wasn't pretty, it wasn't elegant, and it certainly wasn't fast, but it was mine . I made that. From installing the server to writing the HTML, I owned that service from end to end and had completely…

Yeah. That sense of ownership has been lost. Now corporations own everything. Nobody wants a domain, they want a @name on some social media platform. Nobody wants their own website, they want to post on social media. ISPs have cgNAT now, nobody is directly connected to the internet. Everything is just so boring .

cgNAT is going to go away, even for the rare ISPs that use it, as more connections become IPv6-only.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#149
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you making this more complicated than it needs to be? A large proportion of folks on HN seem to think GDPR is "out to get" everyone rather than a set of common sense regulations that should not at all be a concern for an individual who's serving a blog or personal site and doing nothing to collect PII/track their visitors. I don't understand why this view is so prevalent.

Companies whose bottom lines are affected by GDPR are screaming that it's too difficult to understand and apply. Many HackerNews, especially for some reason North American ones, are parroting what they hear in this echo chamber without giving it a glimpse of a thought. I think we underestimate the power of PR way too often. Last I've read GDPR itself it's been way clearer than any of the Terms of Service written by t…

I don't think "parroting" is very charitable. What I think is going on is that we have a bunch of people who are seeing the internet driven by ads that are only a synthesis of print ads and TV commercials. The fact that the medium of advertising (and business itself, evidenced by all the people who say that's the only way businesses can be run anymore) resembles the past so much means the value of participating in it at all for Computer Science and nerdly interests in general is contained on the backend, in the surveillance. I think the resistance to this (not to mention the suit against Google to prevent them from eliminating third-party cookies from Chrome) is because advertising becomes boring without the PII shenanigans. If you can't slice and dice people's activities into predictions about what they're going to click on if not buy, then what did I acquire these student loans for, to write HTML and JavaScript like a schmoe?

Of course reality is more particularized and varied, but in the big picture I think GDPR and other threats to surveillance advertising is treated as an existential threat to an entire class of skills, skills that can buy houses.

Re: The old internet shows signs of quietly coming back

#150

The Internet today feels like a big box strip mall in suburbia. While visiting my home town, I looked for a local, independent hardware store. There was only Home Depot and Lowe's. Then I realize how few independent businesses were left. On the Internet, you have Google, Amazon, Reddit, Facebook, Twitter. Much of the good content is hidden in their secret gardens (Facebook, Twitter, and increasingly Reddit). Discover…

The problem is, a lot of the content quality is pretty bad. I remember being a kid in the '90s and viewing page after Geocities page on "Pokemon hacks" which were collections of hearsay versions of what is now known as MissingNo hack, many of which were just plain incorrect. Some of these sites would ask people to send in $5 to get access to the hacks (which was obviously a scam.) The reason the SNR of independent si…

We're human beings. For the best of us, 90% of the conversations and thoughts we have are junk and most of us are worse than that.

Always has been. Probably always will be.

Expecting any internet community to put out more than 10% of good content is an exercise in futility. The only reason why it seemed so much more engrossing and interesting when you arrived on the scene is that you had not acclimated to the room yet, and you were consuming the best, easiest to acquire thought morsels that the community had scrounged out of the trough and recycled until it could stand the test of time within that community.

Then, once you have consumed that bit of the best, you think the rest would be like that as well but instead you find yourself in a room full of people who all know the same things and think similar thoughts, and you season along with them, getting the better secondary and tertiary thought morsels, and maybe contributing some yourself. And then, finally, you see bright fresh faces coming in, following the same trail you followed, coming to the same wrong conclusions you came to, and you think, "There goes the neighborhood" and tell yourself how good it used to be when you were ignorant and didn't know any better.

Eventually you reach the next point, which is realizing that it was always like this. You just didn't know any better. Now you know better, and you also know there is nothing you can do about it. You can stay and help others enjoy their Halcyon days, or you can flee in search of greener pastures.

Suffice it to say, the internet has always been terrible and it has always been great, because it's full of people.

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