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Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

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Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#61

Post by lmkg »

bawolff wrote: post #37
legalcorrection wrote: post #32

It's dubious for Canada to claim worldwide jurisdiction over pictures of Canadians. These two requests, that Clearview "cease collecting, using and disclosing images and biometric facial arrays collected from individuals in Canada" and "delete images and biometric facial arrays collected from individuals in Canada" sound like overreach. Certainly, they can prevent Clearview from doing business inside Canada. Maybe ev…

Its not that different from how eu claims that gdpr applies to all european citizens even if living abroad.

That is literally the opposite of true.

GDPR applies to individuals located in the European Union, and citizenship is not a factor. EU citizens have no GDPR rights while abroad, and conversely non-Europeans have GDPR protection while in the EU.

Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#62

Post by lmeyerov »

Nextgrid wrote: post #19
vkou wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We've created a mess of legal jurisdiction and geography that is difficult to reconcile with globally distributed systems. It's easy to reconcile. If you want to operate in a jurisdiction, you are subject to that jurisdiction's laws, and legal injunctions. This is a very basic thing, on the level that a school-child can understand it. Just because you're operating using computers doesn't change a damn thing. When a…

> If you want to operate in a jurisdiction What defines "operating"? Does it mean you are physically based there? Your infrastructure being there? Your company registration? Your bank account? Etc. Back in the day these weren't problems in practice; for physical goods/services you typically were based in a single jurisdiction. If exporting goods, customs take care of it. The internet has no "customs" equivalent thoug…

Less "what" and more "who"

The jurisdiction decides, and you play by their rules... or leave

Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#64

Post by adolph »

towe12301923 wrote: post #29

> The commissioners found Clearview scraped images of faces and associated data from publicly accessible online sources (including social media) and stored it in its database. > What the commissioners recommended was that Clearview: > • cease offering facial recognition services to Canadian clients; > • cease collecting, using and disclosing images and biometric facial arrays collected from individuals in Canada, and…

Clearview said its facial recognition search engine "compares user-provided images of faces to a database of images indexed from public web pages. The tool allows law enforcement and national security agencies to identify victims and perpetrators of crimes.

How is this fundamentally different from Google image search? [0]

Did Clearview do something to be investigated? The commission essentially claimed they read about the company in the news and decided to act based on that. [1] It seems odd that haven't they investigated Google for the same. [2]

0. https://www.google.com/search?tbs=sbi:AMhZZivCGA7FJZHmFkT5r4...

1. https://www.priv.gc.ca/en/opc-actions-and-decisions/investig...

2. https://www.priv.gc.ca/en/opc-actions-and-decisions/investig...

Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#65

Post by dylan604 »

cakeface wrote: post #56

Is it possible for me to request that Clearview remove any pictures of myself that they have? I'd like to do that.

and how do they prove they did it in a way that makes you believe they did. Or how do you know that they didn't just use your request to confirm your identity? That's like clicking unsubscribe in SPAM.

Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#67

Post by adolph »

Nextgrid wrote: post #19
vkou wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We've created a mess of legal jurisdiction and geography that is difficult to reconcile with globally distributed systems. It's easy to reconcile. If you want to operate in a jurisdiction, you are subject to that jurisdiction's laws, and legal injunctions. This is a very basic thing, on the level that a school-child can understand it. Just because you're operating using computers doesn't change a damn thing. When a…

> If you want to operate in a jurisdiction What defines "operating"? Does it mean you are physically based there? Your infrastructure being there? Your company registration? Your bank account? Etc. Back in the day these weren't problems in practice; for physical goods/services you typically were based in a single jurisdiction. If exporting goods, customs take care of it. The internet has no "customs" equivalent thoug…

> What defines "operating"?

If some aspect of an operation can be detained, expropriated, or extradited, now or in the future, then it operates in that jurisdiction. Otherwise it is just talk. Hence Assange is slowly on his way to the US; Snowden is just cold until the US has something to offer.

Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#68

Post by reaperducer »

adolph wrote: post #64
towe12301923 wrote: post #29

> The commissioners found Clearview scraped images of faces and associated data from publicly accessible online sources (including social media) and stored it in its database. > What the commissioners recommended was that Clearview: > • cease offering facial recognition services to Canadian clients; > • cease collecting, using and disclosing images and biometric facial arrays collected from individuals in Canada, and…

Clearview said its facial recognition search engine "compares user-provided images of faces to a database of images indexed from public web pages. The tool allows law enforcement and national security agencies to identify victims and perpetrators of crimes. How is this fundamentally different from Google image search? [0] Did Clearview do something to be investigated? The commission essentially claimed they read abou…

They can both be bad.

You don't stop going after one criminal because there are others.

Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#69

Post by vkou »

Nextgrid wrote: post #19
vkou wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We've created a mess of legal jurisdiction and geography that is difficult to reconcile with globally distributed systems. It's easy to reconcile. If you want to operate in a jurisdiction, you are subject to that jurisdiction's laws, and legal injunctions. This is a very basic thing, on the level that a school-child can understand it. Just because you're operating using computers doesn't change a damn thing. When a…

> If you want to operate in a jurisdiction What defines "operating"? Does it mean you are physically based there? Your infrastructure being there? Your company registration? Your bank account? Etc. Back in the day these weren't problems in practice; for physical goods/services you typically were based in a single jurisdiction. If exporting goods, customs take care of it. The internet has no "customs" equivalent thoug…

> What defines "operating"? Does it mean you are physically based there?

Whether or not I do any business with anyone controlled by the jurisdiction.

It's not a problem in practice.

I can host a website that pisses on Putin in the United States. I have no intentions of ever going to Russia. I don't rely on any Russian services. A Russian may visit it, because, well, Russia has access to the internet. I may be breaking Russian law, but I don't care, because I'm not operating in Russia. Russia can tell their ISPs to block me, or can ask for my host to cut me off. My host isn't likely to comply, because it too, is unlikely to have ties to Russia.

I put up an ad from a Russian company on it. I'm now operating in Russia, and Russia can shut that part of my business down, by forcing the Russian company to stop doing business with me. Once they do, I'm no longer operating in Russia.

Some jurisdictions reach further than others. Russia (or Canada) has jurisdiction over its corner of the world, and little else. The United States has jurisdiction over a very large part of the world, because a lot of businesses that I would partner with have an American presence, and will comply with American requests. China is somewhere in the middle. Its reach extends somewhat beyond its borders, but doesn't straddle the world.

Re: Clearview AI challenges B.C. privacy watchdog order

#70

Post by adolph »

reaperducer wrote: post #68
adolph wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clearview said its facial recognition search engine "compares user-provided images of faces to a database of images indexed from public web pages. The tool allows law enforcement and national security agencies to identify victims and perpetrators of crimes. How is this fundamentally different from Google image search? [0] Did Clearview do something to be investigated? The commission essentially claimed they read abou…

They can both be bad. You don't stop going after one criminal because there are others.

Seemingly neutral laws can be enforced inequitably or corruptly. A government that goes after the little guys and gives big cos a pass is illegitimate.
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