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An Experience with Modafinil

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Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#141

Post by darawk »

inter_netuser wrote: post #59
ipnon wrote: post #49

What's remarkable to me is that modafinil is less toxic than caffeine[0], and possibly even less addictive[1], but we all know which is illegal for recreational use and which is coffee. Regulations are sticky. The FDA follows the precautionary principle. Political game theory incentivizes restricting what the electorate can do rather than giving them more freedoms, and being blamed for whatever harm may fall upon the…

Caffeine would be illegal to possess, if it were invented yesterday. 80% of people couldn't distinguish I.V. cocaine from I.V. caffeine in some study I am unable to locate at the moment, which I think involved Nora Volkow from NIH, either as PI or collaborator.

As someone who has consumed both IV cocaine and IV caffeine, this is ridiculous. They are very, very distinguishable.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#142

Post by bloqs »

ipnon wrote: post #49

What's remarkable to me is that modafinil is less toxic than caffeine[0], and possibly even less addictive[1], but we all know which is illegal for recreational use and which is coffee. Regulations are sticky. The FDA follows the precautionary principle. Political game theory incentivizes restricting what the electorate can do rather than giving them more freedoms, and being blamed for whatever harm may fall upon the…

Be extremely careful with it. A friend of mine developed some horrifying skin issues after relatively light use.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#143

Post by marcan_42 »

ei8htyfi5e wrote: post #125
majormajor wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cramming is less "required" then "an alternative way to get a good grade than working all semester long."

It wasn’t a paper test and cramming. I had to create a product from scratch. I could have made a simpler product but I’m type a and challenged myself. 3D modeling, waiting for a 3D printer to complete, designing and manufacturing creating circuit boards, programming them, setting up a server, modifying the printed case by hand to insert glass, iterating when tolerances aren’t right. …it was a lot of work. But now I g…

> Honestly believe if you give me enough time and money I can make anything. Worth it.

Same, but it didn't take a week on modafinil to finish a crazy project for me, I just always just liked making cool shit ever since I was a kid. Currently more on the software/kernel side, but I've done my share of hardware projects.

For me, after bouncing around a few universities, I realized how much of a broken joke the system was and resolved to go the easiest route to get the piece of paper (an on-line university), which I'm glad I did because the one time in my life I needed it it was important... but uni never taught me anything I couldn't have learned more efficiently on my own.

I distinctly remember that time in a microcontrollers class where the book was wrong and teaching the exact opposite of the solution to the problem it was trying to teach, and I'd known about that one for like 7 years at that point, and when I offered to the teacher to write a little article about it so we could all learn about it, he said yes and never even read it...

Or that time where as a sophomore I was helping a team of seniors working on a project to build a CubeSat, and I designed the PCBs and all the firmware and we won the competition to get funding and actually launch... and the uni's response was to kick us out of the lab we were in because "we were using too much space" (about 1m of desk space there). That CubeSat never launched.

Also, there was one part of that board designed by a professor instead of me. It was the only part that didn't work. And I thought it was dodgy at the time, and with my current experience I can confidently say that design was utterly insane and broken and he had no idea what he was doing.

Meanwhile in Calc II they wanted me to memorize three dozen identities because... why? I liked math until I got to that class, because even though it wasn't exactly being taught in an engaging way, I could work out the underlying concepts and understand and appreciate it, and work from first principles. Then it got complicated enough that doing that at the exam was no longer viable and I was just expected to become a computer and memorize all the damn formulas (and it wasn't just a few), understanding be damned. I cheated my way through that exam ("yes professor, I promise this TI-84 emulator on my Zaurus PDA is exactly like the real thing and I don't have a little formula database app in another window"). I damn well know what integration is and how it fundamentally works and how to apply it, but storing rote trivially looked up information is what we have paper and computers for. I don't go around memorizing programming APIs, I look up what I need and whatever I use often enough comes naturally.

Chemistry was more fun. We were allowed one index card, handwritten, both sides for the exam. I developed an electrical arc sharpening mechanism for mechanical pencil lead, so I could handwrite it all in 4pt size or so. Give me limitations and I will make the best use of them :)

Yeah, the system is broken.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#144

Post by bb88 »

mcbits wrote: post #137
dpark wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You remember the topic and the name of the PI but still can’t find this study? I am relatively certain that’s because it does not exist. The idea that caffeine is comparable to cocaine is pretty nuts. People murder to get cocaine. When’s the last time anyone murdered for Starbucks? I can totally believe that if you give someone who’s never done drugs a high dose of caffeine and tell them it’s cocaine, they might beli…

> People murder to get cocaine. When’s the last time anyone murdered for Starbucks? If people could buy cocaine at Starbucks (or get cheap stuff at a dollar store), would supply be such a problem for users that they resort to crime? If caffeine were banned tomorrow and prices rose a thousand-fold, to what lengths would millions of addicts go to postpone the dreaded headache, constipation and lethargy for another day?

Having had caffeine headaches in the past, I just take some aspirin + ibuprofin and turn off the lights.

I would expect society would have a bad weekend, and then people would get over it quickly.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#145

Post by bb88 »

darawk wrote: post #141
inter_netuser wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Caffeine would be illegal to possess, if it were invented yesterday. 80% of people couldn't distinguish I.V. cocaine from I.V. caffeine in some study I am unable to locate at the moment, which I think involved Nora Volkow from NIH, either as PI or collaborator.

As someone who has consumed both IV cocaine and IV caffeine, this is ridiculous. They are very, very distinguishable.

Or you're in that 20% that can. He still has an out.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#146

Post by s5300 »

bloqs wrote: post #142
ipnon wrote: post #49

What's remarkable to me is that modafinil is less toxic than caffeine[0], and possibly even less addictive[1], but we all know which is illegal for recreational use and which is coffee. Regulations are sticky. The FDA follows the precautionary principle. Political game theory incentivizes restricting what the electorate can do rather than giving them more freedoms, and being blamed for whatever harm may fall upon the…

Be extremely careful with it. A friend of mine developed some horrifying skin issues after relatively light use.

Huh.

Apparently the skin issues from it can be so severe it’s being warned that Stevens-Johnson Syndrome is a possible adverse effect of it.

Initially first results showed that despite the warning there had yet to be an actual case in documented literature, but scrolling further showed a case in an early 20’s patient in 2018. Scrolled back up, & the first results were from 2017… so yeah I guess.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#147

Post by 8note »

mcbits wrote: post #137
dpark wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You remember the topic and the name of the PI but still can’t find this study? I am relatively certain that’s because it does not exist. The idea that caffeine is comparable to cocaine is pretty nuts. People murder to get cocaine. When’s the last time anyone murdered for Starbucks? I can totally believe that if you give someone who’s never done drugs a high dose of caffeine and tell them it’s cocaine, they might beli…

> People murder to get cocaine. When’s the last time anyone murdered for Starbucks? If people could buy cocaine at Starbucks (or get cheap stuff at a dollar store), would supply be such a problem for users that they resort to crime? If caffeine were banned tomorrow and prices rose a thousand-fold, to what lengths would millions of addicts go to postpone the dreaded headache, constipation and lethargy for another day?

Lots of people can get opiates pretty easily, and it's not without problems

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#148

Post by pfortuny »

mcbits wrote: post #137
dpark wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You remember the topic and the name of the PI but still can’t find this study? I am relatively certain that’s because it does not exist. The idea that caffeine is comparable to cocaine is pretty nuts. People murder to get cocaine. When’s the last time anyone murdered for Starbucks? I can totally believe that if you give someone who’s never done drugs a high dose of caffeine and tell them it’s cocaine, they might beli…

> People murder to get cocaine. When’s the last time anyone murdered for Starbucks? If people could buy cocaine at Starbucks (or get cheap stuff at a dollar store), would supply be such a problem for users that they resort to crime? If caffeine were banned tomorrow and prices rose a thousand-fold, to what lengths would millions of addicts go to postpone the dreaded headache, constipation and lethargy for another day?

You have read about Oxycontin, right? Totally legal and legitimate…

Honestly: easily accessible opiates are known (history) to do a lot of damage.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#149

Post by the_only_law »

nkozyra wrote: post #5
Fezzik wrote: post #3

I’ve wanted to try Modafinil for a long time but I’m too nervous to order it online. My doctor won’t prescribe it to me, saying it is only for extreme narcoleptics, though I think the real reason is that its street value is pretty high… because it works.

Preface this with whatever caveats necessary: adrafinil is a modafinil prodrug which is unscheduled in the U.S. In other words, it's effectively modafinil in vivo. Secondary note: I was once prescribed modafinil for severe sleeping issues before I knew it had some street/techbro value (maybe it didn't then). My experience was not great. I only took it for three days and then stopped. I would say the effect on wakeful…

Adrafinil has the hepotoxicity concerns, as well as the unpleasant taste and urine scent.

There are other modafinil analogues/prodrugs, but I’m not overly familiar with them. Flmodafinil seems relatively popular.

Re: An Experience with Modafinil

#150

Post by the_only_law »

senectus1 wrote: post #7
Flankk wrote: post #2

Is this person insane? Four hours of sleep and six cups of coffee per day? Lay off the drugs and get a good 8 hours sleep.

used to do this a lot. still recovering from it. I suspect my mind is permanently damaged in subtle ways from this behaviour. either that or 47 is "wind down time" for my brain

Yeah this is probably not too far from my daily routine, except replace coffees with energy drinks. Though I oversleep significantly on the weekends (normally aided by the effects/after effects of shit that’s worse for my brain).

It very obviously has major negative effects, but I just can’t bring myself to change it. I’ve tried once or twice, but I always return to this.

If life was a little more flexible, I think I could pull off biphasic sleep and be ok, but when I want to sleep I usually have meetings and when I’m wide awake it’s usual the middle of the night (writing this at 3:25am).

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