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70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

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Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#261
post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because everyone who seriously invests money in businesses knows that there’s a performance hit you take as a remote company. People haven’t been paying for offices for the last ten years for no reason. Engineering is one segment where this penalty seems to be lower. However, engineers seem to be unable to understand that every other function functions better in person. The tradeoff you’re hoping to make is that the…

Not my experience at all. The last two companies I've worked for where 100% remote, in both of these places engineering was a lot more productive. I personally invested less total time in work (about 7 or 8 hours total) and got a lot more done. Both of these companies had a culture of writing things down, so everything was documented, an all important conversations where posted in the open for anyone to see. Everythi…

100%.

The reality is that most managers have done little to no thinking about (nor have they ever been formally trained on) actual management. So when taken out of the environment in which they "learned" to manage, largely through example, they have no framework or theoretical knowledge to fall back on for what effective remote working looks like.

We have a hybrid working model but some of our employees are genuinely remote and never come to our in-person offices.

It works well but it takes co-ordination effort by leaders to make it work.

I think there genuinely are benefits to in-person work for certain collaborative elements of work but it makes no sense to just say "there are productivity costs to remote work" without actually answering the key questions, namely:

-For what kind of roles?

-For what kind of tasks within those roles?

-By how much? Does any loss of productivity get made up for saving office costs, commute costs for employees, lower cost of living? If your productivity goes down but it's by less than costs... well maybe that's ok actually!

-Have you quantified other benefits like retention? Even if a remote employee is now less productive (not proven tbh) they are still more productive than the new hire who isn't up to speed on your tech yet, not to mention certainly more productive than the person who no longer works for you and the people who have to interview their replacement.

It's bizarre that people say, well there are costs and benefits to remote, without actually even attempting to quantify them.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nobody cares that an employee doesn't learn, it is irrelevant. I have learned shitloads as an employee, and that's why I get paid more now than ten years ago. If you aren't learning at work, something is wrong.

The employee cares, but most employers do not. That's why changing jobs every couple years gets people 20% pay increases these days but they're lucky to get an inflationary raise at their yearly review.

Employers might not care in the short term, but in the long term they have to, because the general skill level of the labour market will be significantly diminished.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#263

I get why remote work is popular, and for some tasks/jobs I think it can work well. However, I think in-person interaction is critical for breaking new ground, starting new initiatives, etc. So far, nothing replaces being in the same room hashing out ideas on the whiteboard, etc.

Why ? Working remote , never being late to a meeting , never having to commute, vastly outweighs all that. I have an odd feeling many people like in person work so they can socialize. We have bars and concerts for that. We somehow went from COVID will kill us all if we dare step into an office to shut up and get back to work. Stop wasting money on office space. Let people live wherever ( assuming your in the same cou…

> I have an odd feeling many people like in person work so they can socialize. We have bars and concerts for that.

The splitting of society like this is awful for humans, we really aren't built for it. There are ways of addressing this and still keeping remote work, but removing socialisation for 8 hours a day is not it.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whereas remote work is an extreme aberration from the norm. No it’s not, it’s just new to you so it seems scary. Companies have been dealing with this for decades with branch offices, contractors, etc.

> branch offices, contractors, etc. Branch offices isnt remote, and contractors are mercenaries. Look, I think there is not "one" answer to this. I personally can't think of anything worse than complete remote. Its isolating, difficult to understand the entire company and everything requires explicit communication. Some companies do this well, Most do not. However I have worked with fully remote workers, and they lov…

Remote workers aren't stopping you from paying for an office, driving to it, and working there.

You seem to not only want to work in an office (fine), but you want other people to.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The tradeoff you’re hoping to make is that the increase in talent pool outweighs the decrease in productivity. No, the trade-off is being able to hire the best people possible instead of the best people who will work in the office. Honestly, the office has been dying since 4G and high speed internet got everywhere. Offices should be optional - there if you need it, there for meetings, team work sessions and present…

Meanwhile in Palo Alto, I was spending hours every workday trying to get a Terraform apply to complete without crashing out thanks to my apartment's crappy, crappy internet connection. Hell yeah, remote work!

I do go to offices occasionally, as we have an on site data centres and I have to do things to it, also meet up every month or two with teammates to go for beer.

I can't get any of my normal day-to-day work done in the office because of the crappy internet. I don't have 4 monitors there either unlike at home.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#266
post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a precisely zero percent chance that customer service works better in person. I have done it personally. My mom did it for over a decade from home . Engineering is not the only task that can be done remotely.

I actually work in customer service for a tech company right now. We do some days in the office and most days remote. Being remote is worse for productivity. For instance, when I need to ask a team mate a question, they respond in slack at their convenience. At the office it takes 20 seconds. Communication and collaboration seem orders of magnitude more difficult remotely. Yes, client services can be done remotely. Y…

> I can see the number of tickets we close and remote is just more unproductive.

I used to work in that area. We had someone on the team that would go through open calls that were waiting for a response, phone the user at 3AM, not get a response, and close it with "assume this is fixed, please reopen if not".

He was far more productive than the suckers who spent 6 hours fixing a single fault.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#267
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Because everyone who seriously invests money in businesses You're right, so let's follow the money... I regularly work with investors who acquire businesses (AUMs are typically ~$1B, I guess that is serious enough?). > knows that there’s a performance hit you take as a remote company. - I don't know a single one who deliberately has said "there is a performance hit if they are remote, we should switch to in office…

> I don't know a single one who deliberately has said "there is a performance hit if they are remote, we should switch to in office to increase performance". Because you can’t. The decision to go remote is a one way door. > People have also have been enforcing 40 hour weeks and argue open offices are better for performance. Open offices are a management trend and hardly universal among successful companies. Whereas r…

>> I don't know a single one who deliberately has said "there is a performance hit if they are remote, we should switch to in office to increase performance".

> Because you can’t. The decision to go remote is a one way door.

That's pretty hand wave-y. If there is money in it companies will do it. It wouldn't be much different than moving an office or factory.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People keep on saying this but it's just not obviously true. How is it obviously not true? I mean. I love remote work. I started working remotely way before it was mainstream and I'm advocate for it. I've managed remote teams for many years too. Even so, I can't claim there's no performance hit. I just think the performance hit is small enough that in most cases the benefits for people and businesses outweigh it.

Obviously not true != not obviously true. I think you’ve misunderstood the comment you’re replying to.

Yes I did not parse that correctly. Thanks.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People keep on saying this but it's just not obviously true. How is it obviously not true? I mean. I love remote work. I started working remotely way before it was mainstream and I'm advocate for it. I've managed remote teams for many years too. Even so, I can't claim there's no performance hit. I just think the performance hit is small enough that in most cases the benefits for people and businesses outweigh it.

I am curious. I guess it also depends on the company, but endless meaningless meetings is pretty popular. With online teams, do you feel like there is the performance advantage?

I'm not sure I follow. Endless meaningless meetings is an orthogonal problem. Regardless of remote vs on-site, I try to avoid meetings without a clear agenda, purpose and inviting only relevant parties. Not inviting people just to 'keep them in the loop', we have meeting summary/notes for that. I encourage team members to decline meetings they do not feel will be valuable, exercising their own judgement and with an explanation to the organizer.

Re: 70% of startups offer remote work options as hiring heats up, YC data shows

#270
post #52

I honestly don't understand how any startup can even hope to compete if they don't offer remote options. Hiring is incredibly tight right now, and I'm sure glad my options are "anybody within ~2 timezones" over basically only people within a 15 mile radius of my office because traffic is horrendous in my city. Not to mention, how have companies not realized how to build robust remote company cultures over the past 2…

There seems to be a maddening amount of head in the sanding by execs/VCS etc. I work at a company that’s been fully remote for 2 years but they keep trying to target a Return to Office date that keeps getting pushed back. Just see the reality, accept remote is going to be permanent and invest in making that better for everyone.

I guess most execs/VCs are the kind of people who spent most of their career at "McKinseys" of this world, and this all they know. They want to return to their comfortable baseline.
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