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No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

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Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#751

Post by sneak »

jimmaswell wrote: post #748
thrashh wrote: post #739

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We’re not talking smoking though We’re talking second hand smoke Who exactly is looking to get some second hand smoke in their face while avoiding actually smoking?

I seem to be in a small minority, but I always liked the smell of second hand smoke despite never smoking. I've smelled some cigarettes up close and I think I'd really like them, but I don't want to start for health reasons.

The difference is that you consent to someone else's drugs entering your body.

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#752

Post by hcurtiss »

area51org wrote: post #741
TameAntelope wrote: post #693

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't politics, it's safety. I accept the argument that the CDC has become overly innumerate in how to live a healthy life, but it's not a liberal or conservative idea to be cautious.

There is such a thing as being unnecessarily and overly cautious, however. This sure seems like a good example of that.

Exactly. Precaution comes at a price. The question is whether the benefits of the precaution outweigh the costs. And that is an answer science cannot, and should not, answer. These days, it seems, many scientists are desperate to cloak their policy preferences in "science." That is precisely why there is presently so much distrust of scientists.

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#753

Post by wolverine876 »

mattmaroon wrote: post #682
dionidium wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to feel some dissonance about this, you might note that this is the exact language the CDC uses for things like secondhand smoke -- "There is no risk-free level of exposure to secondhand smoke" -- which everybody nods along to and accepts without much scrutiny. Source: https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_statistics/fact_sheets/seco... Meanwhile, when it's something like, say, cosmic radiation exposure from c…

The CDC has been unfortunately hopelessly politicized. It happened long before the pandemic. OTOH, I would make the differentiating point that air travel has positive benefits to society and costs and one has to weigh those against each other. You can’t make the blanket statement “earth would be better off if air travel went away completely.” It’s hard to find any benefit to smoking, first hand or second, so it’s eas…

> The CDC has been unfortunately hopelessly politicized.

These accusations are a common way to tear down democratic institutions, handing power to corporations and powerful individuals. Do you have evidence of it? I've seen none, other than some things attempted by political appointees during the Trump administration.

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#754

Post by wolverine876 »

xyzzyz wrote: post #745
dleslie wrote: post #730

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should be discouraging all air travel. All of it.

No, we shouldn’t. Instead, we should work on ensuring that as many people are able to enjoy new opportunities it provides if they do desire as possible. Everyone should be able to enjoy life.

Climate impact is significant. That's going to interfere with generations enjoying their lives.

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#756

Post by wolverine876 »

jillianschuller wrote: post #710
some_random wrote: post #627

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've noticed that most health recommendations like these do not have any evidence associated with them, or a description of the actual risks. It seems that the doctors and health officials who write them have the evidence, but don't believe that the public needs to see it and rather should just go with whatever they say.

Having recently become pregnant, a lot of the guidance for expectant mothers echos these blanket recommendations (sushi, deli meats, hot baths etc). On the topic of alcohol, FASD is a massive concern, but it's known that it's correlated to how much you drink and how frequently you drink (enjoying a glass of wine once a month is very different than binge drinking multiple times throughout your pregnancy). The thing is…

Congratulations!

Lacking clear research (in this case, we lack intoxicated pregnant people to study, as you say), I tend to rely more on expert judgment to sort out the facts, bringing to bear their knowledge of physiology, anatomy, chemistry, and disease; their long experience with many thousands of actual people, etc. I have none of that. If I break my arm, that's my only experience with it.

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#757

Post by pirate787 »

wolverine876 wrote: post #753
mattmaroon wrote: post #682

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The CDC has been unfortunately hopelessly politicized. It happened long before the pandemic. OTOH, I would make the differentiating point that air travel has positive benefits to society and costs and one has to weigh those against each other. You can’t make the blanket statement “earth would be better off if air travel went away completely.” It’s hard to find any benefit to smoking, first hand or second, so it’s eas…

> The CDC has been unfortunately hopelessly politicized. These accusations are a common way to tear down democratic institutions, handing power to corporations and powerful individuals. Do you have evidence of it? I've seen none, other than some things attempted by political appointees during the Trump administration.

The CDC (formally Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) has long tried to enter the gun control debate. That has nothing to do with their mission of communicable disease prevention. Congress has repeatedly voted to block them.

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#758

Post by wolverine876 »

pirate787 wrote: post #757
wolverine876 wrote: post #753

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The CDC has been unfortunately hopelessly politicized. These accusations are a common way to tear down democratic institutions, handing power to corporations and powerful individuals. Do you have evidence of it? I've seen none, other than some things attempted by political appointees during the Trump administration.

The CDC (formally Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) has long tried to enter the gun control debate. That has nothing to do with their mission of communicable disease prevention. Congress has repeatedly voted to block them.

The wider medical community has been vocal about gun control, because guns are a leading cause of injury and death. The fact that it's not a virus or bacteria is arguably a pointless technicality, incidental to saving people's lives. The people who catch the 'bullet' disease are treated at hospitals by doctors.

You may not think it's appropriate, but many doctors disagree. There's nothing in that indicating it's politicized; people may want to politicize gun control, Coronavirus, and lots of other health issues, but that doesn't make the health institutions political for dealing with it. (They also want to politicize the CDC and every other democratic institution (the Post Office, etc.).)

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#759

Post by xyzzyz »

wolverine876 wrote: post #754
xyzzyz wrote: post #745

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, we shouldn’t. Instead, we should work on ensuring that as many people are able to enjoy new opportunities it provides if they do desire as possible. Everyone should be able to enjoy life.

Climate impact is significant. That's going to interfere with generations enjoying their lives.

We should then work on enabling people to fly with no climate impact. For example, using zero emissions energy to synthesize jet fuel. The goal should be to enable people, not to block them.

Re: No amount of alcohol is good for the heart, says World Heart Federation

#760

Post by AlbertCory »

SomewhatLikely wrote: post #700
AlbertCory wrote: post #668

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sibling posts make the right point: lots of things are objectively bad for your body, but your emotions are part of it, too. If alcohol or whatever makes you happier, then it's "good for you." Until you have so much that it's not good for you anymore. It's the same for sweet desserts: why TF should you deprive yourself of all of them? Just keep it in moderation.

We could imagine a very different society with much less consumption of alcohol but people still being equally happy. If someone is made to feel unhappy when they don't drink because everyone around them is doing so, the fact that then consuming alcohol makes them happier shouldn't be pointed to as evidence the person is making a good trade off between bodily harm and happiness.

This post is kind of involved.

No, you shouldn't be made to feel unhappy; or rather, you should push back harder against anyone who tries to effectuate that. Being sorta Stoic here: no one can "make" you feel anything.

It's none of their business, after all.

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