Earlier quoted context omitted.
Your lack of understanding does not make it nonsense.
Your rewriting of history is though.
My rewriting of History? What rewriting?
Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
211–220 of 272 posts
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
Uhmm, I don't know where you were getting your information, but yes, it was pretty clear.
"I would say 50% would have to get vaccinated before you start to see an impact," Fauci said. "But I would say 75 to 85% would have to get vaccinated if you want to have that blanket of herd immunity." https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/1... the fraction of people who would need immunity to SARS-CoV-2 (either through vaccination or recovery from prior infection) to extinguish the spread of the…
That might all be true, but it’s all cherry picked out of context. Had we had broad vaccine immunity in the early days of the pandemic, the situation may have turned out differently. Over time, things change.
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
As of the posting of this comment, from the white house : > While so-called “breakthrough infections” among this group do happen, they remain the exception: In fact, recent data indicates there is only 1 confirmed positive case per 5,000 fully vaccinated Americans per week. The startup I work for must be incredibly unlucky given that 7+/14 vaccinated employees have recently tested positive if the odds really are 1 in…
> The startup I work for must be incredibly unlucky given that 7+/14 vaccinated employees have recently tested positive if the odds really are 1 in 5000. I'm sure my anecdote is not unique. Now do the comparison of hospitalization and death of the unvaccinated against the vaccinated. > The same way that people, and doctors, have been biased against reporting side effects. Yeah, sure, its just anecdote, except there's…
>Now do the comparison of hospitalization and death of the unvaccinated against the vaccinated
Official UK data shows approximately equal rates of death between vaccinated and unvaccinated.
>There's papers that have been published by every single government, relevant NGO, hospitals, literally the entirety of modern medicine dedicated towards working on this. The conclusions are always the same
Yes, because the orthodoxy is rigid and pervasive.
>There are tons of qualified experts who are more than happy to talk about the failures, doubts, and validated skepticism of big pharma in a myriad of drugs and medical trials.
But there are exceedingly few fields where questioning the orthodoxy is career and social suicide. Your faith in the system blinds you its politics. The bottom line is that, again, there is no incentive to report breakthrough cases, few people are doing so. All data is therefore suspect, and all current conclusions stem from this faulty data. And officials have yet to acknowledge this problem. Meanwhile despite high vaccination rates the virus continues to spread at record pace, while we are lied to about the effectiveness of the vaccines, now retroactively with emergent claims by apologetic laypersons, that the vaccines were never intended to stop the spread of the virus.
The same bias at the heart of this collective goalpost shift has infested the academic and political establishments and is kept in place by the implicit threat of being labeled an "antivaxxer".
Step outside of the argument and consider, for a moment, how many political, corporate, and academic careers would be destroyed, how much credibility would be irreversibly trashed, if it were proven that the vaccination campaign was a failure, or worse, that it caused more harm than good? Same for social distancing, masking, and lockdown campaigns. Don't you see that there is a mountain of momentum behind the official dogma regarding covid vaccination? Ultimately these are people with families to feed and career aspirations to maintain, with lifetimes of sunk costs to protect. It is reasonable to presume that the truth may be suppressed in an implicit, emergent manner, especially considering the current unabated state if the pandemic. At the very least I hope you would acknowledge that the messaging is not quite lining up with the statistics. We can pretend that this is just part of the scientific process, but I am alleging that because of political pressure (both state and corporate) the process has been heavily biased from the start. It is trivially easy to massage data, models, and analyses to match preconceived conclusions, intentionally or otherwise, especially when turning against the consensus comes with severe social and career costs.
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'm sorry but I'm not understanding the logic. The booster was recommended after several rounds of research across multiple countries suggested it was a good idea, with Israel doing some of the first testing and reaching the conclusion that it was worthwhile (and it was, by a substantial margin). You are misinformed. There is a paucity of data supporting boosters, what little exists is for people over 65 (to be fai…
The article was posted in September. Since then all analysis has validated the booster strategy, even in individuals who previously had COVID. The increase in incidence in pediatric COVID patients since the Omicron wave supports the assertion as well. I'm sorry but new meta-analyses are coming up every week. It's been 4 months since that article and the conclusions in said opinion piece have been proven wrong.
No post body was provided.
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#215If I understand correctly, israel mandates a third shot (to do normal stuff), as do many places in north america, either now or soon. And I can only imagine many people would be happy to mandate a fourth as soon as possible. What I find most frustrating is that politicians are happy to make these mandates live, during an ongoing situation where we actually don't know a lot about how effective things are (and in the c…
To the people asking for caution about these vaccines, how long did it take from development to roll out for the polio shot? Was there the same reluctance?
Apples and oranges. One disease killed and maimed millions of children while the other disease is nothing more than a flu (for most of the population).
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
You should probably read the data, and not just the title and conclusions: > Among those previously infected, until the emergence of the Omicron variant, the cumulative incidence of COVID19 was not significantly different between those vaccinated and unvaccinated, even at almost a year of follow-up. > However, among those with prior COVID-19, vaccination was not associated with significantly lower risk of COVID-19 in…
So at the very worst it does nothing. How is that bad? I don't want to go around checking if people had or did not have Covid, which a lot of people are prone to lying about.
No. At the very worst the vaccine causes harm, and provides no benefit.
> I don't want to go around checking if people had or did not have Covid, which a lot of people are prone to lying about.
We're not talking about sterilizing immunity. Even the best case arguments for booster doses in the young are citing efficacy against "symptomatic illness" that is well below 100%.
Case in point: I just had it. I'm triple vaccinated. I'm not alone.
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#217If I understand correctly, israel mandates a third shot (to do normal stuff), as do many places in north america, either now or soon. And I can only imagine many people would be happy to mandate a fourth as soon as possible. What I find most frustrating is that politicians are happy to make these mandates live, during an ongoing situation where we actually don't know a lot about how effective things are (and in the c…
To the people asking for caution about these vaccines, how long did it take from development to roll out for the polio shot? Was there the same reluctance?
How many "boosters" did the polio vaccine need ? The polio vaccine was a real vaccine that provided 90% LIFELONG immunity protection to all three types of poliovirus not this Covid vaccine crap that required "re-definition" of the word vaccine.
Covid vaccines have created many, many new billionaires.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/giacomotognini/2021/04/06/meet-...
Covid is Big Pharma's ultimate wet dream where they can continually keep pushing mandated 'boosters' for every new variant onto the gullible public through uncertainty and fear. And make sure to 'generously donate' to the health-committee politicians enforcing recommendations/mandates.
https://www.statnews.com/feature/prescription-politics/feder...
https://theintercept.com/2021/12/14/pfizer-moderna-covid-vac...
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#218There are two separate questions: Does an extra booster prevent infection? Does an extra booster reduce hospitalizations and deaths? Seems this study only addressed the first question. But instead of giving a fourth shot based on the OG Covid, seems an updated version based on omicron, delta, and any new variants of concern would be a better idea.
I can't for the life of me understand why your last statement isn't what the world is driving for at the moment. mRNA vaccines are easily(-ish) updated, so punch out an Omicron specific dose and get on with the regular single/dual (if needed) regime. It seems strange we'd opt for 3-4-5 shots given the benefit of mRNA was its ease of creation and modification.
It should be pretty clear at this point that we're not going to vaccinate our way out of transmission.
I doubt there's a lot of utility to boosting a 4th time with anything unless you're immunocompromised in some way.
And by the time we start vaccinating for Omicron it'll likely be too late and we'll be onto the next variant which the Omicron booster will only partially cross react with.
But the vaccines have largely done their job, the boosted mature T-cell response is what is going to be saving lives and keeping people out of the hospitals. And the virus probably can't mutate enough to ever escape from T-cells.
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#219Record cases across the planet regardless of vaccination rates...how much longer until official sources are willing to acknowledge that these vaccines are not nearly as effective as claimed? How long before official sources acknowledge that breakthrough cases are probably drastically underreported? I can't be the only one surrounded by fully vaccinated individuals testing positive. Its happening far too often for me…
The vaccines are preventing hospitalizations and deaths which is really most of why Omicron is considered to be "mild".
How much longer will it take to admit that its still the unvaccinated driving all the hospitalizations?
And I'm not at all surprised that a shot given in the arm doesn't give sterilizing mucosal immunity in the upper respiratory tract. It was never expected to (which is why the nasal vaccines are still garnering considerable interest).
Call it a communications flaw if you like, but this was more or less expected.
Fauci himself was setting expectations lower for a VE of around 50% back in the summer of 2020 before the Phase III trials published the 90% numbers. Those didn't account for waning immunity or escape variants like Omicron though, although their 90% VE against severe disease and hospitalization is still holding up fine.
Re: Israel Finds Fourth Covid Booster Is Ineffective
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
The article was posted in September. Since then all analysis has validated the booster strategy, even in individuals who previously had COVID. The increase in incidence in pediatric COVID patients since the Omicron wave supports the assertion as well. I'm sorry but new meta-analyses are coming up every week. It's been 4 months since that article and the conclusions in said opinion piece have been proven wrong.
Quoted post unavailable.
> No, it hasn't. You are making things up -- which is why you keep [etc.]
Flamewar swipes have repeatedly been creeping back into your comments here. Please edit them out. Not only are they against the site guidelines, they discredit your position, which is particularly bad in the case that you happen to be correct.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...