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Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

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51–60 of 85 posts

Re: Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

#51

1. Fighter jets in battle-ready condition are rare to start, even more so one flying in the right spot at the right time to shoot down a hostile jet 2. No one is dumb enough to even try fighting US jets with their own. US have the best aircraft, missiles, and more flying hours than anyone else

2* no one the us has gone to war with.

Re: Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

#52
post #32

Air to air combat kills are rare because the strategic circumstances that would make them numerous enough to be unexceptional would likely tree up to minor-to-major nuclear conflict. More directly, am struck that the average person has yet to internalize that in modern high-intensity conflict detection roughly = mission kill if not outright destruction. Everything operationally important (air, sea, ground) that wants…

> More directly, am struck that the average person has yet to internalize that in modern high-intensity conflict detection roughly = mission kill if not outright destruction. Everything operationally important (air, sea, ground) that wants to survive needs to avoid emission/detection long enough to detect something else first and destroy it. Only if you're willing to go in the enemy's weapons engagement zones - wheth…

> Detection/track ranges are generally much higher.

This is absolutely not true. For modern weapons, the effective range is generally limited by detection, whether you are talking about heavy SAM (like the S-400, with it's 400km range) or modern AAM (like the Meteor or R77M, with ranges ~200km).

As a rule, it's relatively cheap and easy to increase missile range, so they are not limited by ability but by choice. SAM ranges are pushed past reasonable detection ranges because it allows siting the missiles more to the rear, which is safer, and for the missile batteries to provide mutual support. AAM ranges are pushed past detection to increase the size of the no-escape zone, which is usually thought to be more important than the actual maximum range.

Re: Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

#53
post #3

Because you're trying to shoot something flying at 500 miles an hour, piloted by a tiny lunatic who actually thought this sort of thing was a good career move and is probably on military-issued meth, with a projectile the size of your thumb, while also being the exact same sort of lunatic? :-D

> ... with a projectile the size of your thumb I have a dummy shell from an A10 at my desk. Here's an image (not mine) (the nearly 12" shell on the far left): https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-23308fca719553f998cbc4... Now, the A10 is air to ground, and these shells are made for killing tanks and not aircraft and you're not wrong in that the projectile isn't that much larger than a thumb, but just seeing the dang…

Aircraft in WW2 used even bigger caliber rounds as well. The advancement over the war from firing machine guns to cannons is pretty bonkers.

Re: Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

#56
post #3

Because you're trying to shoot something flying at 500 miles an hour, piloted by a tiny lunatic who actually thought this sort of thing was a good career move and is probably on military-issued meth, with a projectile the size of your thumb, while also being the exact same sort of lunatic? :-D

> probably on military-issued meth The US military issues meth? Source?

The Nazis issued meth ("pervitin") to all branches of their armed forces, including the Luftwaffe. So this is definitely true in a historical context.

Re: Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

#58

I think fighter jets will go extinct some time in the near future. The maneuvering, speed and stealth of drones will soon outdo any manned fighter because they’ll push beyond the limits of human physiology. Even more, the cost of the drones will be cheaper.

Agreed; in fact I think we're already there and the only reason the human pilot hasn't shaken out of the equation is lack of a large-scale war to prove how ineffective they are. If there was such a conflict—and it somehow avoided going nuclear—who would win, the side that can make a few hundred fighters and trained pilots a year, or the side that can crank out 10,000+ drones in a month?

Re: Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

#59
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_drugs_used_by_milita... Cousin of meth.

This is very strange to me considering that Adderall was a disqualifying factor when I joined the service. Very interesting, I had no idea this was used today. Appears that Amphetamine is no longer used but Modafinil is not even close to being "meth" > Modafinil is not considered to be a classical psychostimulant, but rather is classified as a eugeroic (wakefulness-promoting drug) and is used primarily for treatment…

There's a huge difference between making something available to someone in a prolonged combat situation, or where a drop in situational awareness could get them and others killed, and needing that substance during comparatively "easy" civilian life.

Not defending that viewpoint or assertion but that's very likely the justification that would be used. Needing it for HS or college is disqualifying while choosing to use it for a particular operation is not.

Re: Why are air combat kills so rare? (2017)

#60

Why are we discussing an article from 2017 with no real information besides, USA number 1? Asymmetry is the key to airpower, if you don't have it you won't have it. Look-first shoot-first is only one kind of asymmetric advantage.

> Asymmetry is the key to airpower

No -- it can't be possible! I always hear people say "flexibility is the key to airpower." I feel so lost.

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