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Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

toot.cat

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Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#291

Post by onion2k »

moralestapia wrote: post #91
jeroenhd wrote: post #42

In my opinion, there shouldn't be. Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. Reducing someone's life history to a list of educational institutions and employers feels robotic even for a software developer's mindset. I understand that there are real life problems because companies do use automated processing on applications, but that kind of behaviour shouldn't be en…

>Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. That's very nice to think about but in the real world if people don't match some exact keywords they get thrown away. HR is looking for "node.js" but you wrote it like "nodejs"? Though luck pal, bye. HR wants a "computer scientist" but you have a degree in "computer science"? Same, automatically discarded. If anything, a st…

HR is looking for "node.js" but you wrote it like "nodejs"? Though luck pal, bye. HR wants a "computer scientist" but you have a degree in "computer science"? Same, automatically discarded.

Fixing that would require not only a universal data format but also a universal taxonomy of terms to describe skills. That would need everyone to agree on how to describe what they do. Easy enough when you're describing programming languages, but effectively impossible for any softer skills. This is precisely why you need the human aspect.

The way to fix the issue you describe is to educate HR people, not to try to apply technology to a non-tech problem.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#292

Post by tomcat27 »

jeroenhd wrote: post #42

In my opinion, there shouldn't be. Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. Reducing someone's life history to a list of educational institutions and employers feels robotic even for a software developer's mindset. I understand that there are real life problems because companies do use automated processing on applications, but that kind of behaviour shouldn't be en…

> educing someone's life history to a list of educational institutions and employers feels robotic even for a software developer's mindset.

that's a flawed view imo.

there could be plenty of catch-all sections to maintain "descriptions"

resume content expectations are largely driven by industry.

i've not heard of someone reading resume more than 10s.

the whole job posting industry dug themselves into a meaningless, needless task: parsing resume pdfs. heck, some even use "AI" for it.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#293

Post by david38 »

moralestapia wrote: post #91
jeroenhd wrote: post #42

In my opinion, there shouldn't be. Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. Reducing someone's life history to a list of educational institutions and employers feels robotic even for a software developer's mindset. I understand that there are real life problems because companies do use automated processing on applications, but that kind of behaviour shouldn't be en…

>Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. That's very nice to think about but in the real world if people don't match some exact keywords they get thrown away. HR is looking for "node.js" but you wrote it like "nodejs"? Though luck pal, bye. HR wants a "computer scientist" but you have a degree in "computer science"? Same, automatically discarded. If anything, a st…

In what tech companies does HR still filter resumes? I haven’t seen this is over a decade.

Recruiters, hiring managers, and specialized software is all I see.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#294

Post by dahart »

moralestapia wrote: post #91
jeroenhd wrote: post #42

In my opinion, there shouldn't be. Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. Reducing someone's life history to a list of educational institutions and employers feels robotic even for a software developer's mindset. I understand that there are real life problems because companies do use automated processing on applications, but that kind of behaviour shouldn't be en…

>Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. That's very nice to think about but in the real world if people don't match some exact keywords they get thrown away. HR is looking for "node.js" but you wrote it like "nodejs"? Though luck pal, bye. HR wants a "computer scientist" but you have a degree in "computer science"? Same, automatically discarded. If anything, a st…

Your argument makes the case for human reviewers.

The examples are a stretch though. I've never heard of anyone losing an interview due to their spelling of nodejs or computer science. I don't buy that's something that happens often enough to spread FUD over.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#295

Post by tomcat27 »

jfengel wrote: post #63

I used to work in ontologies, and what I learned is that people would rather get an 80% heuristic solution for dirty data rather than a 100% correct solution for data they have to clean. The big job sites have resume parsers that work well enough from a PDF or Word doc, and then they don't have to worry about you forgetting a close tag or a mandatory field. Sure, stuff gets lost, but they get 80% of a billion resumes…

that still doesn't really explain why big companies have not initiated a RFC for resume format. they only have to come up with an RFC and just ask everyone to follow.

The cost of producing such an RFC is so small. guaranteed reduction in inefficiencies including operational costs.

my gut feeling is that 20% improvement could have big butterfly effects.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#296

Post by tomcat27 »

CalRobert wrote: post #22

There is! https://jsonresume.org/ But nobody really uses it for data interchange. I use it to render my resume in new layouts now and then. Although, it does let style dictate content sometimes (some templates force you to have dates down to the day for job start and end dates, etc.)

I came across this before. wish it's an accepted format on job portals.

A challenge I see is -- resumes change wildly by industry.

a tech resume is totallly different from an actor's resume.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#297

Post by withinboredom »

onion2k wrote: post #291
moralestapia wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Documents like these shouldn't be automatically processed, they should be reviewed by humans. That's very nice to think about but in the real world if people don't match some exact keywords they get thrown away. HR is looking for "node.js" but you wrote it like "nodejs"? Though luck pal, bye. HR wants a "computer scientist" but you have a degree in "computer science"? Same, automatically discarded. If anything, a st…

HR is looking for "node.js" but you wrote it like "nodejs"? Though luck pal, bye. HR wants a "computer scientist" but you have a degree in "computer science"? Same, automatically discarded. Fixing that would require not only a universal data format but also a universal taxonomy of terms to describe skills. That would need everyone to agree on how to describe what they do. Easy enough when you're describing programmin…

I'm pretty sure my Resume says "crazy outside-the-box madman" on it somewhere near the top. It pretty much guarantees that I work somewhere with a sense of humor while rejected from places that take themselves too seriously.

Resumes aren't just a list of skills and work history (education isn't even on my resume anymore), it's also a chance to let a small amount of your personality show through so you stand out against the pile.

Of course, if you're submitting to a big corp, you'll be fighting against AI reading your resume first, so, write for that if that's how you roll. I usually only apply to smaller companies that apparently end up as bigger companies by the time I move on.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#298

Post by CasperDern »

anhu wrote: post #289
colejohnson66 wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d say they are. Who cares if I write “Nodejs” or “Node.js”? The reader knows exactly what I meant, and that’s what matters. Anything else is just needless pedantry.

It’s not about the fact but about how much you care. Don’t let your counterpart think. Making such „mistakes“ actually shows quite a bit about the counterpart starting with correctness and precise communication. Back then it drove me nuts when someone wrote „advanced in AngularJS 2“ - and it kept coming!

As inconsistent as it is, "AngularJS" is the correct spelling and casing, that's probably why it kept coming. Just check the official website.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#299

Post by withinboredom »

benrbray wrote: post #248
jeromegv wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FYI Not an English native speaker It’s a document sent to tons of people. Revised by tons of hiring managers. Can’t you spend 5 minute looking at a dictionary? If you cant be bothered to spend 5 minutes researching this for an important document, what makes me think that you will spend 5 minutes trying to be good at your job. Lack of care on your resume is lack of care on lots of other things.

Companies don't seem to treat it like an important document. I can't tell you how many times an interviewer seemed to be reading my resume for the very first time during the interview itself...

As the interviewer, in several places I've worked, I'm usually handed the resume 10 minutes before the interview along with a couple of questions my manager wants me to ask. By that point, it's gone through HR, managers, etc. You're getting hired if you can get past me and whomever I'm interviewing with.

There was even one time they forgot to give me the resume... that was probably the funniest interview ever. They got the job too.

Re: Why isn't there a universal data format for résumés?

#300

Post by KMnO4 »

CasperDern wrote: post #298
anhu wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not about the fact but about how much you care. Don’t let your counterpart think. Making such „mistakes“ actually shows quite a bit about the counterpart starting with correctness and precise communication. Back then it drove me nuts when someone wrote „advanced in AngularJS 2“ - and it kept coming!

As inconsistent as it is, "AngularJS" is the correct spelling and casing, that's probably why it kept coming. Just check the official website.

I think the point was that AngularJS is V1. Version 2 and beyond is just called “Angular”.
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