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Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

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Re: Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

#21

Post by pjerem »

Well, pretty much all the JavaScript stuff is one decade old. All the technologies before that were SSR (the term SSR didn’t even exists).

So you can totally make an application only with server side technologies because it was how we did before and… it just worked. What is interesting is that all the frameworks, due to their age are very mature.

If you are ok with Python, I suggest you to go through the official Django tutorial, it’s pretty long (some hours iirc) but it covers a lot of topics by guiding you through the development of a complete application.

But other frameworks like Rails, Symfony, are also very mature. ASP.NET Core with Blazor is also nice but IMO, harder for a newcomer because it needs a lot of boilerplate.

All those technologies are pretty boring, but in the good way: they allow you to get shit done without thinking a lot about technical issues.

Re: Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

#22

Post by ale_jacques »

SahAssar wrote: post #16

Just talked on a slack about this. I strongly dislike htmx since it creates a DSL where there wasn't one needed. I think in general if you don't need to build custom behavior (which a SPA enables) then going pure SSR (without any of these) is a good way. If you need custom behavior then these solutions probably won't be enough. To me it feels like a very small slice that needs these solutions but still don't need a "…

Just to clear some things out: the "_" on the is something hyperscript specific (not part of htmx). You could (and should, I guess) go with native JS for the validation.

Hyperscript is another project from the same author of htmx and is a side project not related to htmx. Though, it can be complementary.

Re: Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

#24

Post by simantel »

SahAssar wrote: post #19
josefdlange wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you correctly identify that the typical use case for HTMX is something very narrow. There's a small no-man's-land between a full SPA and an SSR app where you might want to see content moving around without full page flashes, but don't need a lot of complexity/finely-tuned interactivity. I've used HTMX _alongside_ some more fully-baked JS on our site. There are some particular use cases that are a lot more rap…

The hx-post/swap and similar are pretty small and simple to write for yourself though, so you don't need to include the full suite of htmx. If it was me and I only used those bits I'd probably write them myself or use a library that only focused on those things without the whole DSL.

HTMX doesn't include the whole DSL - the example above is using Hyperscript, which is a separate project by the creators of HTMX.

Re: Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

#25

Post by simantel »

codingclaws wrote: post #20

If you do everything with SSR and only use form submissions on the front-end, then you can get 0% front-end JS with most stacks.

Yeah, but these new libraries are nice for the use case where you want to add something like an upvote button or inline comments, where otherwise you'd have to spin up an API endpoint and write some JS.

Re: Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

#27

Post by lambdaba »

connorlay wrote: post #14

Coming from React + Phoenix, adopting Phoenix Live View has been a big productivity win for my team as we are all full-stack developers.

Interesting. I gather you migrated a React App? Did you somehow find that there was nothing a full-JS client SPA could do that Live View couldn't? Did you have to make any compromises or any downgrades in the UX?

Re: Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

#28

Post by oh_boy »

My job is to build frontends on top of various client management systems and figured out, that I get more maintainable code and am more productive using the templating of the CMS itself instead if decoupling the frontend from the CMS entirely.

So since two years, I use the Hotwired stack on top of PHP (and now with Vite as bundler) and that is so far the best solution I found. I can like use the CMS integrated solution for handling forms, as an example, but can plug in Hotwired Turbo and some Stimulus controllers when I want things to happen async on the client. I now have my own set of generic stimulus controllers I reuse in every project. But at the end of the day, those websites work without JavaScript.

Re: Ask HN: Experiences w “JS-free” front ends? (Hotwire, Unpoly, Inertia.js, htmlx)

#30

Post by cmclaughlin »

I used the intercooler, which is the predecessor to htmlx and really liked it. I plan to use htmlx on my next web development project.

I recently took a look at Hotwire and Unpoly just to make sure I wasn’t missing out on something better. I found htmlx simple and intuitive.

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