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YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

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Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#31

Post by smcl »

contravariant wrote: post #29
smcl wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you've incorrectly invoked "free speech" here, IMO this isn't a free speech issue. It may be a TOS issue and it does sound like Google are being a bit unreasonable but "free speech" isn't really something Google ever promised to permit on their platforms

The idea that companies should be allowed to trample all over basic freedoms because they're not the government has to be the most capitalist idea ever.

What basic freedom are these companies trampling? I dislike them as much as the next person, but it's been clear from the start that they operate their little fiefdoms as they see fit and we should be under no illusions that we have no rights there.

If we want to fight for a change to the various laws in various countries, then that is a conversation I would be very willing to have. But let's not pretend that any of these companies have ever offered their services as a place where you can exercise whatever version of free-speech laws your country has.

Interestingly the places that tout "free speech" as a feature tend to descend into pretty grim places full of racism, anti-semitism, conspiracy theories and more besides (hello, 8chan/kun!).

Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#32

Post by bavell »

contravariant wrote: post #29
smcl wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you've incorrectly invoked "free speech" here, IMO this isn't a free speech issue. It may be a TOS issue and it does sound like Google are being a bit unreasonable but "free speech" isn't really something Google ever promised to permit on their platforms

The idea that companies should be allowed to trample all over basic freedoms because they're not the government has to be the most capitalist idea ever.

Capitalism is an economic system that works best in a free market without monopolies. I believe the word you're looking for is corporatism, where huge companies have subsumed the role of government (e.g. controlling speech).

Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#33

Post by foxfluff »

smcl wrote: post #30
raxxorrax wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is that not a free speech issue? It is not a legal issue of course, but removal of critical opinions very much qualifies to be a violation of the principle.

Because it's basically never been a thing there. Facebook, Twitter, Google - all of these platforms can and do remove things from their platforms for whatever reason they feel like. There's nothing we can do about it, there is no free speech there and acting indignant like they're eroding some right that you previously had is just pointless. It'd be like complaining that you can't get sushi at McDonalds anymore. You…

There's no "anymore" in these complaints though. There's just the complaint.

It's not "my parents started beating me while they in the past didn't", it's just "parents are beating me." Or "google is suppressing my speech."

Past actions of the involved entities do not invalidate the complaint. Likewise, "the grocery store next door doesn't sell sushi" is a legit complaint for the afflicted regardless of whether sushi was sold in the past or not. (Coincidentally, my go-to store just stopped selling sushi a week or two ago)

Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#34

Post by smcl »

1ris wrote: post #28
smcl wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you've incorrectly invoked "free speech" here, IMO this isn't a free speech issue. It may be a TOS issue and it does sound like Google are being a bit unreasonable but "free speech" isn't really something Google ever promised to permit on their platforms

I absolutely disagree. But we had this debate over and over and over again. It would be great if you could stop rehashing is debate once more. I some twist of irony, this comment is against the HN TOS. So please stop.

How is my comment against the HN TOS?

Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#35

Post by [deleted] »

smcl wrote: post #30
raxxorrax wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is that not a free speech issue? It is not a legal issue of course, but removal of critical opinions very much qualifies to be a violation of the principle.

Because it's basically never been a thing there. Facebook, Twitter, Google - all of these platforms can and do remove things from their platforms for whatever reason they feel like. There's nothing we can do about it, there is no free speech there and acting indignant like they're eroding some right that you previously had is just pointless. It'd be like complaining that you can't get sushi at McDonalds anymore. You…

[deleted]

Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#36

Post by [deleted] »

cobrabyte wrote: post #14
usr1106 wrote: post #7

It's called surveillance capitalism for a reason. Remember it's also totalitarianism, you don't have free speech when using free services. (libre vs. free) Edit: Of course lack of free speech is what Trumpists complain about, too. I say the same although I would use free speech for very different content.

> Of course that's what Trumpists say, too Trump really did break some people.

[deleted]

Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#38

Post by smcl »

foxfluff wrote: post #33
smcl wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's basically never been a thing there. Facebook, Twitter, Google - all of these platforms can and do remove things from their platforms for whatever reason they feel like. There's nothing we can do about it, there is no free speech there and acting indignant like they're eroding some right that you previously had is just pointless. It'd be like complaining that you can't get sushi at McDonalds anymore. You…

There's no "anymore" in these complaints though. There's just the complaint. It's not "my parents started beating me while they in the past didn't", it's just "parents are beating me." Or "google is suppressing my speech." Past actions of the involved entities do not invalidate the complaint. Likewise, "the grocery store next door doesn't sell sushi" is a legit complaint for the afflicted regardless of whether sushi…

> But it's unfair to block a guy that talked about a real flaw in Grammarly's plagiarism checker, at least pretend that you allow free speech and take down that video for a random reason specified in your ToS.

See italicised section, it suggests there's a promise of free speech on Google that are somehow reneging on. I am just saying that this is a mistake, and now loads of people seem to be mad at the idea that I'm attacking "free speech". One of the reasons I thought it shouldn't be here is that it's fairly complex topic that IMO is orthogonal to the case in question because it raises all sorts of thorny side-issues that distract from the main thing: someone got booted from Google quite unfairly.

Re: YouTube suspended my channel for a video with disclosed issue in Grammarly

#39

Post by iqanq »

altdataseller wrote: post #4
Sosh101 wrote: post #3

I wonder how much money Grammarly have spent with youtube.

I read somewhere they are among their top 10 advertisers. So this is not a good look for YouTube. Hope someone from Google chimes in because this is a PR disaster in the making

What do you mean a PR disaster, something people get upset about on Twitter for 3 days and then forget?
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