Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Train burglaries in LA

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 652 posts

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#31

Post by Ansil849 »

20after4 wrote: post #27
Ansil849 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems like finding some way to prevent the thefts is better. It seems like it should be possible to use locks which are harder to open in a short amount of time...but I suppose the cost of that would outweigh the current costs of the theft for the railroads.

It's very difficult to make a lock that is really secure. Bolt cutters and battery powered saws / grinders are very powerful, portable and effective tools to cut through metal.

Average time needed to get into a container (X) needs to be > average time train pauses (Y). This seems like it should be a solvable problem.

For example, just thinking out loud, what about some sort of container door hinge mechanism which takes five minutes (or an adjustable amount of time) to open the door?

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#32

Post by idontwantthis »

rdtsc wrote: post #3

Wonder how organized that looting is. Is just individuals over many months or years, or a large gang over a few weeks time. On the one hand it’s shocking to see it in LA in US. On the other I am surprised it’s not happening more often. In large cities, some of my acquaintances had to get PO boxes as their packages kept getting stolen. But why bother wasting time going house to house, when you can hit a whole train ca…

I wonder if it's organized or just like kids in a candy store. There's so much to steal, I wonder if there's need for conflict or management.

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#33

Post by dredmorbius »

King-Aaron wrote: post #24

> Responsibility for policing the railroad right of way falls on Union Pacific Police... not local agencies like LAPD So is 'Union Pacific Police' just a security company, or do you guys in the US actually have private businesses with their own police? Because that sounds pretty dystopian

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police

Railroads emerged at a time when the only significant national law-enforcement entity would have been the military or US Marshall's service. (There were some customs and coast guard operations, also the postal police dating to 1772, before the United States declared their independence from England.)

Railroads operated across town or city, county, and state boundaries. They had a highly distinctive geography --- the linear alignment of tracks. And multi-jurisdictional law enforcement with competing interests would have been (and remains) problematic.

So railroads provided (or contracted, often through the infamous Pinkerton Agency) their own security serivce. Many railroad police have full law-enforcement police and arrest powers.

Note that there are other businesses and operations with some similar capabilities. A ship's captain traditionally had extraordinary powers when at sea, many hotels have or had house detectives, the US Postal Service as noted has its inspector service, and US Marshalls provide security aboard aircraft, though with partial coverage. Their presence and function received heightened awareness after the 9/11 attacks of 2001.

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#34

Post by zo1 »

Seattle3503 wrote: post #18
fblp wrote: post #12

Sigh - Any resourced and competent police or security force should be able to catch or deter thieves that are stealing packages from the same location . Additionally, mail theft laws which include prison as a consequence should be extended to package thefts if they don't already cover them.

> Additionally, mail theft laws which include prison as a consequence should be extended to package thefts if they don't already cover them. But it is a nonviolent crime. It seems like finding some way to prevent the thefts is better.

I disagree. If you prevent this one, some people will stop, whilst others will just find something else to steal elsewhere. It's like a big game of wack-a-mole.

I'd much rather we arrest them so they can be rehabilitated or helped. Which is a separate discussion, but there have to be consequences. Sometimes it's too late to help them and we just need to stem the damage they do to society and other people that are innocent.

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#35

Post by OnlineGladiator »

systemvoltage wrote: post #29
nightsd01 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very few people want to actually defund the police. But try being a black friend of mine, who got thrown out of his car without resisting and beaten so bad he had to go to an ICU, purely because he was driving a car that “matched the description” (that didn’t even match the color) of a crime in the area, and perhaps you can begin to understand why the “other side” is frustrated… And let me guess. You think these trai…

I am well aware of the colloquial term "Defund the police" which is often met by "No, not literally defund it". But the reality is that there is a strong support to reduce resources and move towards soft-policing. Have you been to the Bay Area? Apartment complexes and condominiums are hardened like castles while their kids play in the safe courtyards and the outside is rotting to the point of unsafe for male padestri…

The police are already ridiculously well-funded (on average, there are exceptions). Look at their budgets and start asking "where the hell does the money go?"

They don't need more money. They need to be held accountable.

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#36

Post by mngnt »

I would expect this kind of pictures from a third world country...

How come no one is incentivized to fix this - protect the trains, prevent this loss of property? Who pays for the stolen goods? I presume it would be the retailers, is it just a drop in the ocean for them?

In some more dystopian movies there were trains crossing vast areas of postapocalyptic hellscape protected by soldiers with machine guns and flamethrowers. In these pictures, the "responsible" just gave up. I find that simiarly dystopic.

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#37

Post by King-Aaron »

unityByFreedom wrote: post #30
King-Aaron wrote: post #24

> Responsibility for policing the railroad right of way falls on Union Pacific Police... not local agencies like LAPD So is 'Union Pacific Police' just a security company, or do you guys in the US actually have private businesses with their own police? Because that sounds pretty dystopian

> Railroad police are certified state law enforcement officers with investigative and arrest powers both on and off railroad property in most states. They also have interstate law enforcement authority pursuant to federal law. > The railroad police force dates to the mid-1800s, when the number of U.S. Marshals was insufficient to police America's growing rail network. Members were called Pinkertons, named after their…

Thanks for that. We have railroad police here in Australia as well, however it's all state government sponsored, I just hadn't heard of private enterprise funding police before.

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#38

Post by pmorici »

King-Aaron wrote: post #24

> Responsibility for policing the railroad right of way falls on Union Pacific Police... not local agencies like LAPD So is 'Union Pacific Police' just a security company, or do you guys in the US actually have private businesses with their own police? Because that sounds pretty dystopian

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_police#United_States

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#39

Post by caf »

fblp wrote: post #12

Sigh - Any resourced and competent police or security force should be able to catch or deter thieves that are stealing packages from the same location . Additionally, mail theft laws which include prison as a consequence should be extended to package thefts if they don't already cover them.

The agency with jurisdiction here appears to be a private police force: the Union Pacific Police (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_Pacific_Police_Departmen...).

So their resourcing wouldn't take into account wider societal benefits from lower crime - it'd be more about the direct costs and benefits to the business.

Re: Train burglaries in LA

#40

Post by unityByFreedom »

fblp wrote: post #12

Sigh - Any resourced and competent police or security force should be able to catch or deter thieves that are stealing packages from the same location . Additionally, mail theft laws which include prison as a consequence should be extended to package thefts if they don't already cover them.

I imagine this will get sorted since Buffett both invests in Union Pacific and provides insurance. He famously doesn't get involved in the companies in which he invests, but I imagine his people could shoot over a question like, "why is this happening?"
Post reply on HN