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Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

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Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#91

Post by Rd6n6 »

paxys wrote: post #88
ISL wrote: post #28

Members of Congress make ~$174k/yr. [1] It will be an unpopular opinion, but I believe that we should pay better (and demand better) for a job with that much responsibility. Otherwise, a congressperson will be forever tempted to align their incentives with service to causes other than their electorate. I'm fairly certain we should be paying our elected officials at least as much as our football coaches. [1] https://w…

How much is fair compensation for a Congressperson? $250K? $500K? $1M? Why not even more? They certainly have a lot more power and responsibility than a CEO or sports coach who is paid many times that. The problem is that there isn't a free market which any politician's salary can be determined by. Someone can't decide they don't like the salary in the US Senate and apply to the Canadian Parliament instead. Plus, the…

Very high salaries are a countermeasure against conflicts of interest and “lobbying.” We can trust our leaders better if we don’t have to worry quite as much about other parties tempting them

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#92

Post by Rd6n6 »

belter wrote: post #63
ISL wrote: post #28

Members of Congress make ~$174k/yr. [1] It will be an unpopular opinion, but I believe that we should pay better (and demand better) for a job with that much responsibility. Otherwise, a congressperson will be forever tempted to align their incentives with service to causes other than their electorate. I'm fairly certain we should be paying our elected officials at least as much as our football coaches. [1] https://w…

It has been proven multiple times, that already very well paid company managers, will accept bribes for small amounts of money and petty motives. Integrity is not connected to how well someone is paid. Reckless behavior for minor motives that makes people risk careers of years, family responsibilities, seems the norm for some individuals. I collect these cases, as they fascinate me on what they say about human nature…

Can you share some of these cases or research?

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#93

Post by paxys »

Rd6n6 wrote: post #91
paxys wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much is fair compensation for a Congressperson? $250K? $500K? $1M? Why not even more? They certainly have a lot more power and responsibility than a CEO or sports coach who is paid many times that. The problem is that there isn't a free market which any politician's salary can be determined by. Someone can't decide they don't like the salary in the US Senate and apply to the Canadian Parliament instead. Plus, the…

Very high salaries are a countermeasure against conflicts of interest and “lobbying.” We can trust our leaders better if we don’t have to worry quite as much about other parties tempting them

They really aren't. You are implying that highly paid people are automatically more honest, but reality often shows the opposite. There are unlimited opportunities for corruption in these roles, and whether someone decides to act on it or not isn't dependent on them making $125K vs $250K in salary.

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#94

Post by csee »

vineyardmike wrote: post #89
csee wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their insider trading a very small problem compared to the problem of the perverted incentive to steer legislation in a direction that helps their portfolio.

based on what metric? Do we know have evidence of them voting for their own portfolio vs trading their info? Based on data i've seen, it seems more likely that they're insider trading. (Except for republicans trying to support fossil fuel legislation...)

It is far more likely that they're insider trading, but the point is that the magnitude of the negative consequence is vastly different. If they insider trade and make $5 million, that's money stolen from other market participants. Bad, for sure, but the scope of the damage is limited to that stolen $5 million. If it corrupts policymaking by creating a conflict of interest, the scope of damage is uncapped.

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#95

Post by belter »

Rd6n6 wrote: post #92
belter wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has been proven multiple times, that already very well paid company managers, will accept bribes for small amounts of money and petty motives. Integrity is not connected to how well someone is paid. Reckless behavior for minor motives that makes people risk careers of years, family responsibilities, seems the norm for some individuals. I collect these cases, as they fascinate me on what they say about human nature…

Can you share some of these cases or research?

Random sample:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Moffat_(businessman)

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndca/pr/former-netflix-executiv...

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/former-senior-executive-frenc...

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#96

Post by creato »

IG_Semmelweiss wrote: post #71
ISL wrote: post #28

Members of Congress make ~$174k/yr. [1] It will be an unpopular opinion, but I believe that we should pay better (and demand better) for a job with that much responsibility. Otherwise, a congressperson will be forever tempted to align their incentives with service to causes other than their electorate. I'm fairly certain we should be paying our elected officials at least as much as our football coaches. [1] https://w…

No. Hell no. Elected office is a sacrifice and a duty. It is not a way to make a living. Thats how you end up with dinosaurs working those halls for 68 years. I have a better idea. 1)Fix salary at 2x poverty wage. 2) make house members 1:50,000 representation to their county (yes that means the house would explode to 8000 elected officials) 3) tax any earnings above their pre-office historical income avg, at say 98%.…

Pay peanuts, get monkeys.

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#97

Post by User23 »

ISL wrote: post #28

Members of Congress make ~$174k/yr. [1] It will be an unpopular opinion, but I believe that we should pay better (and demand better) for a job with that much responsibility. Otherwise, a congressperson will be forever tempted to align their incentives with service to causes other than their electorate. I'm fairly certain we should be paying our elected officials at least as much as our football coaches. [1] https://w…

I suggest that you spend some time at certain popular bars inside the beltway where you can hear drunk staffers flapping their lips. You will quickly learn that our elected representatives have virtually no responsibility whatsoever beyond maintaining the charade that the USA is in any way a democracy.

The schoolhouse rock look at me I’m a bill thing isn’t even wrong anymore. There’s not a single “legislator” who actually writes legislation anymore. They literally just broker their signatures (those brokers are called lobbyists) to the parties that actually write the laws. It’s a painful bandaid to rip off, but that’s how the system actually operates.

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#98

Post by notacoward »

animal_spirits wrote: post #77
gkoberger wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is already the law. Since the "Stop Trading on Congressional Knowledge Act of 2012", they already have to disclose any stock trades made by themselves, a spouse or a dependent. Because this hasn't fixed the issue, and most don't seem to have any shame, these recent laws (originally coming from Ds but Rs have their own version) prevent them from trading individual stocks while in office.

I think the problem with this act is AFAIK it states they have to report the trades 45 days AFTER they make them. Not before they make them. So they all just wait until 45 days later when it’s not relevant anymore. New news cycle, people forget

AFAICT they wait even longer than that, and suffer no consequences. For example, Rand Paul waited 16 months to disclose his wife's trades in Gilead Sciences.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/08/11/rand-paul...

RP is a particularly grotesque piece of work (not only in this regard), but he's far from alone. Staffers are subject to the same rules, and at least 182 of them have done the same thing.

https://www.businessinsider.com/congress-staff-violated-stoc...

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#99

Post by TheDong »

filoleg wrote: post #46
TheDong wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> because I am concerned that knowing their trades ahead of time publicly might introduce unwanted side effects. Unwanted side effects like them not buying small volatile stocks that are perfect for insider trading, and instead buying large index funds that are difficult to manipulate? Frankly, anyone who's buying small named stocks that the market can move is either 1) a gambling addict, 2) a professional daytrader,…

Maybe I am misreading, but I am genuinely confused how small cap stocks are related to the conversation at all. My concern wasn’t regarding small cap ticker traders, but something more like attempting to manipulate the market movements by doing certain bogus trades, as well as tons of others that someone else could have come up with. Basically, I am sensing there might be unwanted side effects from this, but I am not…

Ah, apologies for not explaining more.

What I meant was that if a congressperson says "I will buy $100 worth of $SMALLCO in two weeks", that would artificially increase the price of that stock, and the congressperson would get less money / traders would profit slightly by selling shares they got cheaply.

This effect is what I thought you were concerned about. Such an effect can only happen if these known trades are a significant fraction of the market cap, or the activity, on that stock.

The reason I'm talking about small cap stocks is that those are the only ones I think such side-effects would occur on, and such manipulation wouldn't really be feasible for things like large index funds or AAPL or such.

Hopefully it makes sense what I'm trying to say now? It would indeed have severe negative side effects for a subset of possible trades, but I don't think those trades are reasonable ones to make.

Re: Congress Needs to Stop Day Trading, Says Sen. Mark Warner

#100

Post by notacoward »

chiefalchemist wrote: post #23

If you've ever wondered why anyone would run for Congress given the pay, this is your answer. What's amazing is how many of them will shamelessly promote the idea of corruption in other countries, and then day trade and grasp their hypeocricy.

That's absolutely correct. It's far from the only way they profit from their offices, but it's certainly one way. It's shameful that you were downvoted for making the point.
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