Toxic culture is driving the great resignation • Hacker News Board

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#141

Post by UncleMeat » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:25 PM UTC

YetAnotherNick wrote: post #45

Areading314 wrote: post #34

A huge problem with this industry is the inflexibility to pay current engineers LARGELY increasing comp each year. The thought is that there is a market rate for an engineer and that pay can increase with the market rate, but this is a fallacy. An engineer that has been at a largish company for 1 year is worth 20-30% more than the year they were hired because they have specific knowledge of the tech stack. Yet that e…

I think the real issue is that changing the companies always gave bigger raise in pay than staying in the company for most of the folks. Most were not changing jobs due to multiple factors like relations, not having to change house, comfort, good office, free food etc. Now this all factors have reduced a lot that staying in current company is looking even worse option. So till employers are able to retain using other…

"Pretty hard" is an understatement. In ten years, somebody receiving a 30% raise each year sees their pay go up by a factor of nearly 14. Over a 30 year career it is a factor of 2600. Somebody starting at 50k would end their career making 130,000,000 annually.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#142

Post by rob_c » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:26 PM UTC

It's the inference that it sucks more to be a coder on average than asking "do you want fries with that?". I'm a little suspicious. It still looks closer to there is some great personal demand, or philosophical divide forming...

A huge factor is also the options open to the individual, which for a talented person in a skilled sector tends to be much better than someone working as a burger flipper.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#143

Post by oxymoran » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:27 PM UTC

“Not surprisingly, companies with a reputation for a healthy culture, including Southwest Airlines, Johnson & Johnson, Enterprise Rent-A-Car”

I find it hard to believe anything in the article when it notes that Enterprise has a reputation for healthy culture…it’s a bunch of former frat boys who think they are salespeople but are really just sleazy con artist. And the you have to wear a white shirt and tie whilst cleaning out and washing vehicles. Also pretty misogynistic atmosphere in some of the branches. Worst place I ever worked.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#144

Post by tclancy » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:28 PM UTC

sbarre wrote: post #131

zackify wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was able to negotiate a 45k pay raise at my current company. After clearly proving my value for about 2 years. I made it obvious that I would accept a role at my friends company if they couldn’t come up. I explained to them nicely that I would rather stay, but I can’t without a large raise. It can be done, but it would have never happened without me pushing them. No company is going to willingly throw out raises th…

In effect, you threatened them into giving you a raise. And I'll say congrats on getting it, but are you at all concerned about your ongoing relationship with management? Do they think "he's good for a few years at least now" in terms of comp adjustment, and/or do you expect a raise again next year? At my company, I understand (but have not seen first hand) that anyone who tries this (either comes to the table with a…

Invert that thinking and it means they assume anyone who is loyal to the company can be treated poorly. There is no reason to be loyal to a company you don’t have a stake in, because they cannot be loyal to you. If making payroll next week requires them to fire you, they will.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#145

Post by ssharp » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:28 PM UTC

foolfoolz wrote: post #7

> Our analysis found that the leading elements contributing to toxic cultures include failure to promote diversity, equity, and inclusion; workers feeling disrespected; and unethical behavior I don’t really believe these reasons or at least they don’t match what i’ve seen. I can only speak for FAANG: I think this is more compensation based than anything else. In an effort to level the playing field FAANGS establish l…

> The other side of pay is current valuations are insane. Many startups are getting A, B and even D rounds with 300-500x (i’ve seen higher than 1000x) revenue to value ratios. Your FAANG may hope to 2x or 3x in stock value while these startups promise 20-30x returns. So you have to pay even more to beat the potential earnings they could get at a startup.

Are startups paying more in salary or is the potential value just coming from options? If they're coming from options, do they have any private liquidity? From the recent IPOs and SPACs of the past year or two, it seems like many are down 50%+ and some of their current market caps are below valuations from their final private funding rounds. Maybe everyone is cashing out super early after public listing before the markets catch up and start to devalue but it still seems like a risky proposition without private liquidity to gamble on that vs. a FAANG.

Plus, with tech market caps still considerably higher than they were 2 years ago, those RSU grants that are vesting now seem like a fantastic retention tool.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#146

Post by indymike » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:28 PM UTC

This article is leaving out a factor that helping every company presented as being less affected by the great resignation: workforce age. Companies that have an older workforce generally have less turnover.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#147

Post by indymike » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:29 PM UTC

2muchcoffeeman wrote: post #51

YetAnotherNick wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the real issue is that changing the companies always gave bigger raise in pay than staying in the company for most of the folks. Most were not changing jobs due to multiple factors like relations, not having to change house, comfort, good office, free food etc. Now this all factors have reduced a lot that staying in current company is looking even worse option. So till employers are able to retain using other…

>* employers are able to give 20-30% raise each year(which is pretty hard)* Can’t be that hard if an engineer can just walk out and get that. What do you think the replacement will cost? And with none of the knowledge.

If I could get 30% every time I changed jobs, I'd change jobs once a month.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#148

Post by throwaway9952 » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:31 PM UTC

xiphias2 wrote: post #129

edmcnulty101 wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happened to the countries that hyperinflated? We're they able to get it under control historically?

Quite often people fled with gold to other places, as the countries confiscated gold from people. US was trusted to hold gold in the world wars, but of course Nixon renegged on the gold standard. Right now people are starting to hold Bitcoin, and it's much harder to take away from them (flying out with a billion dollars of Bitcoin is trivial, as metal detectors won't catch you), so I'm optimistic that the transition…

As inflation continues to grow, Bitcoin is down close to 40% from its highs. I'm not saying you're flat out wrong about potential benefits to holding Bitcoin but a lot of recent value has been washed out from people selling, not buying it.

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#149

Post by mellavora » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:31 PM UTC

xiphias2 wrote: post #124

There's nothing black swan in an inflationary environment that leads to hyperinflation, even if it's for a country with a reserve currency. Every empire hyperinflated itself in the past, people just ignore history and how returning to sound money is inevitable. The only black swan part is that now we have a better alternative to gold.

"better alternative to gold" as in tech stocks?

(just kidding, I know you mean crypto, but its superiority to gold is a bit debatable).

Re: Toxic culture is driving the great resignation

#150

Post by freedom2099 » Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 1:32 PM UTC

blurrypepe wrote: post #139

freedom2099 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very nice! Plenty of people from all around the world (many international IT companies have offices in the area)… my group of friends have more than 7 different nationalities in it! It’s quieter during the winter and very lively during summer. Weather is amazing all year round… there are 16 degrees outside right now. If you feel the need for a something that only a bigger city can offer Canne is 10 minutes away by ca…

Wow! I'm an IT student currently living in Antibes, working in Cannes and with quite a few friends from all over the world working in Sophia. It's a pleasure to see people from France on HN!

I live in Antibes too!