Live data from Hacker News

Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

nasdaq.com

381–390 of 414 posts

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#381
post #285

[flagged]

+1 Genuinely wanted to have a conversation about the intricacies of the Intel supply chain that may have led to such an apology. Certainly, some hacker news community members could have shared some insight from practical experience.

Instead, the conversation was constantly being derailed in a concerted manner. [0]

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29892254

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#384
post #76
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, their party has communist in its name and socially they portray (Authoritarian!-)Communist ideals. But calling their economy communist is really not the whole truth.

It's closer to a highly regulated semi-free market like Singapore, many European countries etc. China is interesting in that they seem to take a more data-orientated decision making process when it comes to determining areas where free-market like behaviors would increase efficiency while keeping strategic capabilities under public funding (despite the efficiency losses). I think most other governments manage this ba…

> in recent decades mostly tending to over-privatize things like utilities and infrastructure

That's exactly what bothers me about our western democracies, I fail to see why critical things like education, medicine, food and infrastructure(including internet-access) should be privatized. These things should belong to the people. Private companies can feel free to produce and sell other things, but they should, in my opinion, keep their hands from certain things.

> they are going to be in a very strong position in the coming decades

No doubt. What I currently wonder, is how afraid of this I should be. I'm not from the US so I don't really get emotional when thinking about the US getting weaker, compared to China. And although the US do things I find to be absolutely not okay, China seems even less compatible with my values.

> People seem to forget that free markets -require- strong regulation

Yes!

> But to do that we need to stop throwing stones from glass houses and actually get down to the business of matching them.

Totally. All I hear currently are politicians and other high-profile people constantly whining about China, while simultaneously manufacturing everything over there and profiting from their cheap labour. That's also something I find comical about the US - Publicy they denounce China, are constantly fighting in a trade war with each other. But so many things are then imported from China, just think about what Silicon Valley would do if China decides to keep their resources for themselves, or to just block the US.

Of course China would probably also have troubes, if the US would then in turn block them. But all I am trying to say is, that I hate the hypocrisy of this so called trade-war.

And now, to try to prove that I am not a shill for either side,

Tiananmen Square was a tragedy, what's happening with Hong Kong and Taiwan is a bit depressing, Xi Jinping and Winnie Pooh look very similar and what they do to Uyghurs is evil.

The US should face more consequences for their oil-wars which they label as "bringing freedom and democracy", patriot act and guantanamo bay are sickening, Edward Snowden and Julian Assange should be freed and given awards, your political "two-party" system is very outdated and overall the US has a really over-blown ego for all the issues it has. Healthcare, social security, wealth-gaps etc.

Maybe this was a bit unnecessary, but I notice that you can't say anything not 100% Anti-China without raising suspicion of being a state-sponsored troll or whatever. Maybe I could be labeled as a russian troll, but believe me, I could rant about their government as well.

Before I forget, last disclaimer: I am mostly criticizing these countries governments and elites, I have 0 issues with ordinary american or chinese citizens as a whole.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i am not an american or chinese so a third party. here is my question. does "America has lost the narrative and the Chinese have gained it without question" this mean till now it was america who was defining what the rest of the world saw and remembered, making history for "everyone" not just for themselves. remember rambo and the mujahideen? america has for long used its power to influence narrative across the world…

Definitely a given that American movies have comical stereotypes for "bad guys". I don't know what to say except that America's pretty divided right now. In some parts, you won't find a lot of love for Israel and the Iran nuclear deal was a good idea. It's hardly a monolith. But I would contest this notion that China is a free market. This is not people voting with their wallets and the government often threatens dir…

i agree that china isn't a free market. i am saying neither is india nor usa. https://www.ndtv.com/business/visa-complains-to-us-governmen...

visa is complaining to usa demanding that india not give preferential treatment to their own card network because india knows usa can unilaterally kill a country's card infrastructure by simply telling visa/mastercard to stop their services. that is abuse of power and not "free market".

>like listing Taiwan as a country in a dropdown box.

uh, doesn't usa like sanction companies from working with iran? is that not violating level playing field? or the anti-bds? https://news.yahoo.com/muslim-group-sues-block-no-boycott-is... https://www.hrw.org/news/2019/04/23/us-states-use-anti-boyco... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-BDS_laws

come on. usa is same as china, if not the same level but cut from the same cloth. saying otherwise is false

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe let's start with the easy stuff then, given that it's genocide. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jul/19/california-f... > The investigations sparked by her case, which is featured in the documentary Belly of the Beast, showed hundreds of inmates had been sterilized in prisons without proper consent as late as 2010, even though the practice was by then illegal.

This is still different - the article you post is a state acting in a way that is, by the quote you posted, illegal in the country it was performed. The actions in China are sanctioned and performed by the government, and are thereby legal.

In fact, the article you post is literally about the state offering monetary recompense for the act - hence, doing the very thing you asked for in your first post.

America is not as bad as China. These false equivalences are supporting genocide.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#387
post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do we live in an alternate reality where open state censorship of media and the Great Firewall are somehow not a thing in China any more?

Of course it is a thing, same as corporate censorship in the West. It’s just that Chinese don’t try to pretend it’s not the case.

Right, otherwise, it's just propaganda and people lying about their own horrific experiences.

Got it.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>corporations are not people and do not have morals or values The irony of this is that all corporations and all decisions and actions taken by corporations are made by people. If anything corporations are the most clear and unmistakable reflection of what it truly means to be human without the masks we wear in daily life. Other than that, yeah I get what you're saying.

This isn't true when the people making the decisions are atypical humans in terms of morality. Consider two identical corporations where one has a normal morally conscious person and the other has a sociopath. If the second corp has an edge in business you could see how it could lead to non-average decision makers.

Attaching a term like "wokeness" to minority dissent over decades or centuries of systemic, cultural, economic, political discrimination, oppression, or abuse in an attempt to group every type of challenge that doesn't fit within a certain criteria of "conservatism and patriotism" is a false narrative. It seems that everyone is trying to find a scapegoat for their own failures or lack of mobility. Arguably, where and how you start in life makes a big impact on where you end up. Therefore, discrimination and oppression with historical basis, spanning generations, in one form or another, is very much more difficult to overcome or to endure.

Corporations ARE amoral entities; reacting to consumer sentiment that often shifts based on cultural or political trends. Their aim is to make a profit for shareholders and other stakeholders. During the times of "cultural conservatism and patriotism" it was enough to say "made in America", albeit unnecessary, since globalization's effects were not an issue. Company leadership being labelled as communist sympethizers may have stoked fears and anger. Being a former supporter of the Nazi party or the KKK (morally objectionable sentiments) meant little. So, was it corporations that were immoral or the lack of outrage from the majority conservative patriots that could explain this difference better?

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#389
post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do we live in an alternate reality where open state censorship of media and the Great Firewall are somehow not a thing in China any more?

Of course it is a thing, same as corporate censorship in the West. It’s just that Chinese don’t try to pretend it’s not the case.

Corporate censorship and state censorship are completely different beasts, and this false equivalence you're trying to paint is obvious FUD.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely a given that American movies have comical stereotypes for "bad guys". I don't know what to say except that America's pretty divided right now. In some parts, you won't find a lot of love for Israel and the Iran nuclear deal was a good idea. It's hardly a monolith. But I would contest this notion that China is a free market. This is not people voting with their wallets and the government often threatens dir…

i agree that china isn't a free market. i am saying neither is india nor usa. https://www.ndtv.com/business/visa-complains-to-us-governmen... visa is complaining to usa demanding that india not give preferential treatment to their own card network because india knows usa can unilaterally kill a country's card infrastructure by simply telling visa/mastercard to stop their services. that is abuse of power and not "free…

I suppose all I could offer in defense is that the Iran sanctions were over nuclear technology, ISIS, etc; not speech or "loss of face". Ugh, still, the Middle East makes the US lose its damn mind.

I hadn't really followed anti-BDS laws (not a thing in my state). Looks like they get slapped down pretty easily by the courts for violating free speech.

Post reply on HN