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Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

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Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#131

Post by Spooky23 »

shmatt wrote: post #17

Good for Serbia for implementing some centralized system. A PCR test result in the U.S has absolutely no way of being verified, either negative or positive In Israel, which swabs every person who lands at the airport. There is a suspiciously steady stream of people flying in from the U.S who were negative before take off and positive 10 minutes after landing

Depends on where you got tested in the US. States like NY, NJ, CA and others have mandatory reporting requirements, so test results get returned to the county or state DOH and are verifiable.

The problem is at the state level, you have a lot of weird political stuff that influences what and how each state performs certain processes.

There’s also a huge flow of travel from US to Israel, and lots of weird corner cases and loopholes. (Just like Canada and Mexico)

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#132

Post by atoav »

azangru wrote: post #31
boringg wrote: post #19

More fuel to the fire - no reason he should get a pass when other people can't. Sorry - it's only tennis and he's trying to cheat to get in. This isn't to political leaders talking about the fate of their people.

> and he's trying to cheat to get in Sorry, I don't really follow those sports news, so maybe I missed something; but how did he try to cheat? He applied to Australian Open for an exemption, and was granted an exemption [0]. How is this cheating? [0] - https://twitter.com/BenRothenberg/status/1478329044156309505

As far as I can follow the accusations this is the current state:

  - lied about travel activity beforr entering Australia (he declared not having traveled within 14 days prior to entering the country but he flew from spain and had an interview in serbia during this time)
  
  - if what zerforschung found here he did not have a negative PCR after getting a positive PCR test first (which would mean he cannot infect others and has bery likely immunity), but a negative PCR and *then* a positive PCR after, which could in the worst case mean he was infected and still travel.
In any case my doubt about the truthfulness might be colored by my experience with the uncorrupting nature of serbian bureaucracy. Were I had multiple instances of public officials trying to get bribes for very basic things.

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#133

Post by aorth »

conistonwater wrote: post #73
roywiggins wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PCR tests can come back positive for several months post-infection, so there may be no point in testing people in that post-infection period, because it will come back with too many false positives to be useful. 180 days sounds long for that, but people do test positive for months sometimes. The reason you can test positive for so long is that it takes time for remnant RNA from the virus to totally leave your system,…

Pointless pedantry, just because I've been watching TWiV: the PCR test is detecting virus RNA because coronaviruses have RNA, and there's no DNA there. The rest I absolutely agree with.

More pointless pedantry from TViV, as I listen frequently as well: the hosts always point out that RT-PCR tests for the presence of viral RNA, but viral RNA particles being inside your nose or mouth doesn't necessarily mean they are infectious. The scale of CT values is 0–100 and lower CT values means more RNA copies. This is used a proxy for infectivity, though it's not terribly scientific. Furthermore, CT values are rarely (if ever) included on the test results.

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#134

Post by Anthony-G »

artursapek wrote: post #99
boringg wrote: post #19

More fuel to the fire - no reason he should get a pass when other people can't. Sorry - it's only tennis and he's trying to cheat to get in. This isn't to political leaders talking about the fate of their people.

If the vaccines don't prevent spread or contraction of the virus, why are people upset with him standing up against these pointless vaccine mandates?

They don’t prevent the spread or contraction of the virus but they reduce the transmission period and greatly reduce the severity of the disease if a fully vaccinated person contracts Covid-19. They may not be a panacea but they’re a very useful tool in dealing with Covid-19 and keeping people out of hospital unnecessarily.

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#135

Post by Scoundreller »

neither_color wrote: post #113
tppiotrowski wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny story I heard recently: Someone tested positive in Mexico but "had to" get home. Flew to Tijuana, walked across the border (no COVID test needed for land crossing), and caught a flight home out of San Diego. It still makes sense to protect the airline employees, but I no longer view a pre-flight test as a reliable measure to stop COVID from arriving in the US.

The Tijuana-San Diego no test trick was possible up until November. Land borders didnt have any testing or inoculation requirements before then. https://www.dhs.gov/news/2021/10/29/fact-sheet-guidance-trav...

Seems like the testing requirements are unchanged, but the vaccination requirements have changed.

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#136

Post by alkonaut »

hugh-avherald wrote: post #123
alkonaut wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean the sensible position would be that a contraindication (allergy against vaccine) and recent infection should be the alternative to vaccination. And obviously an athlete would need to fulfill the requirement of both entry to to country and to the tournament.

That doesn't make much sense to me: it seems to require a person who has an allergy to the vaccine to also get infected. At any rate, the sensible course of action would have been to allow only permanent, approved medical contraindications to be grounds for exemption. Temporary contraindications (like recent vaccination/infection) would simply invoke an apology and a wish they get better soon.

Fair point. But even so I’m concerned that even trusting “note from random doctor” is far too relaxed. Requiring a medical exemption issued in Australia or by a doctor approved by Australian authorites seems much more secure.

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#137

Post by User23 »

jokethrowaway wrote: post #100
qayxc wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plenty of honest people care. Especially Australian natives abroad who weren't able to see their families for months due to travel restrictions. People like Australian snooker player Neil Robertson who was in tears last year when his wife was able to get his father to fly to the UK to see him for the first time in over a year.

They should complain to their useless governments, not to a tennis player who gamed the system.

In the USA at least complaining to our useless government has virtually no effect whatsoever for the typical citizen[1]:

    Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have little or no independent influence.
Which makes me wonder what exactly the talking heads on the tv mean when they talk about "our Democracy," given that we the People of the USA observably have no real democratic input. So who is being referred to with the first person plural pronoun? It's certainly not the vast majority of the citizenry.

I would be surprised if a different result obtains in Australia.

[1] https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746 (2014)

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#139

Post by amf12 »

giarc wrote: post #78
hugh-avherald wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An alternative conclusion is that the entire test certificate was faked and the bogus timestamp is the smoking gun.

I don't think the certificate validity is in question since the URLs of the Serbia government sites can be accessed. Unless the implication is that Serbian government aided in the fraud.

The linked URL does not have a timestamp in the test details. It could be possible that they faked the certificate with the "correct" QR codes, deliberately in the reverse order.

Re: Djokovic's PCR test was manipulated?

#140

Post by samarama »

oxymoran wrote: post #5
Scoundreller wrote: post #4

I find it funny how some countries suddenly make your life a lot easier if you have a positive test history. Canada has a fairly annoying requirement to have a negative PCR test taken within 72h of takeoff (or arrival by car), which can be dicey/expensive in many parts of the world to get, but if you have a positive PCR result from 14-180 days, this requirement drops and travel gets a lot easier than those that never…

Why is that surprising? Recovering from a natural infection is more durable immunity than that of the vaccines. Even more so if you have both.

Not really, they’re both down in The low double digits https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/232698/omicron-largely-evade...
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