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Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

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Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#171

Post by trasz »

network2592 wrote: post #162
Aperocky wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So is the position of Intel that slave labour in concentration camps is an acceptable means of production? This is the very definition of a straw man argument. Very few people actually cares about what really do happen in Xinjiang, hopefully this relatively balanced reporting by Associated Press can shed some light: https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-lifestyle-ch...

Most people would be unequivocally against slave concentration camps. Do not confuse lack of action with lack of caring. Effective action may require collective action. But individually, most people care. Yet, collectively, they cannot seem to do anything meaningful. You are making a statement that is the definition of an ecological fallacy [0] The article you pointed out is hardly balanced. The access of journalists…

>Most people would be unequivocally against slave concentration camps.

When they exist. We know they exist in the US (private prisons), but there are no reliable sources that confirm they still exist in China.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#172

Post by axiosgunnar »

q3k wrote: post #33
axiosgunnar wrote: post #2

Name and shame. We need to divest our manufacturing from China. Perhaps by exposing such practices and nagging hypocrytical companies we can make divestment happen sooner? Twitter mobs could be used for good once.

> We need to divest our manufacturing from China. Not gonna happen until you get rid of consumerism. People want to buy cheap shit, it gives their lives meaning.

I said divest from a authoritorian communist regime that grew too big, not get rid of consumerism.

There is Vietnam, Africa etc.

We can still have our IoT toasters, just manufactures elsewhere.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#173

Post by halpert »

photochemsyn wrote: post #122
halpert wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Well, better never take an Uber ride again either as Saudi Arabia dumped $5 billion into that corporation, didn't it? I see way too many people displaying hypocritical selective outrage over such issues. Starvation and genocide in Yemen is okay with such people, apparently, it's only if China is involved that they get upset? Come on.

I don’t really consider using the services of a public company with thousands of different investors the same thing as directly purchasing the fruits of slave labor. If Uber drivers were slaves themselves, then that would be more comparable to me.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#174

Post by baq »

mmaunder wrote: post #166

What I find most dangerous about the United States bending to the will of China via their corporations is that it's affecting our story telling. The stories we tell define how we remember history, who our heroes are and what we think is worth fighting for. In 2012 the script of Red Dawn (a remake) was changed so that it was the North Koreans invading the US rather than the Chinese. This was done to avoid provoking th…

the job of the regulator is to make the marketplace fair. why not tax income from china for movies made in us so that incentives aren't as twisted?

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#175

Post by defaultprimate »

mmaunder wrote: post #166

What I find most dangerous about the United States bending to the will of China via their corporations is that it's affecting our story telling. The stories we tell define how we remember history, who our heroes are and what we think is worth fighting for. In 2012 the script of Red Dawn (a remake) was changed so that it was the North Koreans invading the US rather than the Chinese. This was done to avoid provoking th…

It's something I've stated repeatedly: The most dangerous part of China is not its military or nukes (they're actually hardly an offensive threat at all). It's how effective their global propaganda, cultural warfare, and data harvesting techniques are. You don't need nukes when you can destabilize and divide an entire country from within while having everything you need and more to psychologically manipulate the population however you want. Even better because they gave you this information voluntarily

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#176

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

bravo22 wrote: post #113
vmception wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ha, a classic prisoner's dilemma. in my case I was waiting for disgruntled shareholders to sell because an aggregate stance was not taken by management or other shareholders, and then when sold it goes to people more or less apathetic. in your case you want people to buy the shares at any price but likely a premium, in order to exercise a goal, which I frankly think is absurd. so guess the market has priced everythin…

Interesting take. Here is my view: If the American consumers of Intel chips -- the people and government actors -- are unhappy with Intel's stance then they can also not buy their chips. This is basically what the Chinese are doing (without owning shares). Now granted the Chinese people have little say in it but the government is ostencibly acting on their behalf. Even if China was a democractic country and the CCP c…

I would fundamentally disagree with the idea that you don't "actually care" about an issue if you're not boycotting people over it. Why can't I genuinely care about Intel doing the right thing here without building a blacklist of Intel-backed AWS instance types I won't use?

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#177

Post by trasz »

network2592 wrote: post #118
em500 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So is the position of Intel that slave labour in concentration camps is an acceptable means of production? Maybe their position is that they have not established as a fact that there is slave labour in concentration camps in Xinjiang? Have you considered that as an alternative possibility? From the article: > The letter now reads that the company prohibits "any human trafficked or involuntary labour such as forced,…

Engaging in epistemic and semantic hair splitting does not alter the reality of slave concentration camps or make it any less worse. Here is a recent article [0] on rape and forced sterilization of Uyghur women. [0] https://nypost.com/2021/12/18/uyghur-women-recall-horrors-of...

Here's an article on the same thing happening in the US: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_rape_in_the_United_Stat....

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#178

Post by AnotherGoodName »

mmaunder wrote: post #166

What I find most dangerous about the United States bending to the will of China via their corporations is that it's affecting our story telling. The stories we tell define how we remember history, who our heroes are and what we think is worth fighting for. In 2012 the script of Red Dawn (a remake) was changed so that it was the North Koreans invading the US rather than the Chinese. This was done to avoid provoking th…

Another example amongst many: Musk is really 'edgy' on Twitter.

He won't say shit about china though. He has a car plant there.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#179

Post by hwers »

mmaunder wrote: post #166

What I find most dangerous about the United States bending to the will of China via their corporations is that it's affecting our story telling. The stories we tell define how we remember history, who our heroes are and what we think is worth fighting for. In 2012 the script of Red Dawn (a remake) was changed so that it was the North Koreans invading the US rather than the Chinese. This was done to avoid provoking th…

Wow, I had no idea about that movie. The trailer and its popularity really makes it clear they are mentally preparing their population for war with the US in a big way.

Re: Intel removes Xinjiang references from shareholder letter

#180

Post by trasz »

ei8htyfi5e wrote: post #111
simion314 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>slave labour in concentration camps Not an english speaker, so is Is "slave" correctly used here or is more like a "metaphor"?, In my mind a slave is someone you own, you can sell or kill. Someone you keep in prison is called different and people kept in prison for political reasons have also different label, religions/race imprisonment might also have a different label.

[flagged]

So essentially something that's considered perfectly normal in American prisons. Bit of a double standards, don't you think?
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