Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is it about the program you don't agree with, if you don't mind elaborating?
Maybe close cooperation with the deeply corrupt and unjust police makes you complicit in the outcomes.
No post body was provided.
Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
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Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#22Human behavior that tends to self-imprison on a large scale is fascinating to me. In the west we see communities opting in to self surveillance 100% of the time, in China it can be literally having your door welded shut so you stay at home. It all stems from the desire to control other people’s behavior to varying degrees. This desire is probably tied to a survival trait, but more often it is to satisfy something els…
Who in this program is surveilling or imprisoning themselves? Having a camera on your house, pointed into the street, is the opposite of self-surveillance. It's a way to surveil people in a public thoroughfare. Some of those people happen to be thieves who steal things from homes and cars, and if they get caught by video surveillance, that's great. What exactly do the neighborhood residents lose by participating in t…
Most ring cameras with audio recording pick up internal conversations.
Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#23I was in Minneapolis a few months ago and grabbed a Lyft. I started talking with the driver about crime surges, mainly the dramatic car jackings increase. He said 22 people he personally knew have been victims of car jacking in 2021.
They are organized and setup drop off points to box the cars in. The 'passanger' then holds them at gun point and another person gets in the driver seat.
Stolen phones and credit cards are also being used for this.
Its out of control. Multiple Amber alerts issued with infants or toddlers in the back seat from separate car jackings are increasingly common. A few days ago another happened. https://www.mprnews.org/story/2022/01/07/1yearold-missing-in...
Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#24Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is it about the program you don't agree with, if you don't mind elaborating?
Maybe close cooperation with the deeply corrupt and unjust police makes you complicit in the outcomes.
Except in this particular case there appears to be a near-zero risk of anyone being "complicit" in bad police outcomes, given that it's opt-in, can only be used on a case-by-case basis, and it's the citizen who searches their own cam footage, voluntarily, and only in response to a specific police request about a specific case.
So, while at first glance at a headline, this might seem problematic, after reading the details, I'd probably be willing to participate. This can't really be abused to create any George Floyd-type situations.
Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
>...It is really only a tiny minority that actually practically need privacy rights Just about everyone needs privacy rights and most care about those rights for themselves. Unfortunately many are very willing to sacrifice other people's rights if they are told it will make them safer or protect the children, etc. (If someone does claim they don't care about privacy since 'they have nothing to hide', ask them for the…
> Just about everyone needs privacy rights and most care about those rights for themselves. I don't think that's true in practice, no. Most people take the "I have nothing to hide" approach, and, sadly, the lives of most people are so uneventful that that's actually true.
> the lives of most people are so uneventful that that's actually true.
That's probably true. The issue is that people with something to hide, need the other people to hide their mundane stuff so that the people with things to hide, don't stand out.
Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#26I was in Minneapolis a few months ago and grabbed a Lyft. I started talking with the driver about crime surges, mainly the dramatic car jackings increase. He said 22 people he personally knew have been victims of car jacking in 2021. They are organized and setup drop off points to box the cars in. The 'passanger' then holds them at gun point and another person gets in the driver seat. Stolen phones and credit cards a…
How is it possible to do this professionally without getting shot or run over?
The first few victims I get. But after it becomes an identified pattern and makes the news people are gonna be on somewhat of a lookout or at least have it in the back of their mind that it's possible and the odds of your victim seeing the trap before you've got it complete go way up.
Sure you can try and profile people and avoid the car with five dudes in it and go for the middle aged lady in the car with a real estate agency sticker on the door but even then you can only point a gun at so many people before someone's knee-jerk reaction is to either hit the skinny pedal and GTFO or whip out their own piece. This seems like the kind of crime you can only commit 5-10x before you get unlucky and it goes off the rails.
Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#27I was in Minneapolis a few months ago and grabbed a Lyft. I started talking with the driver about crime surges, mainly the dramatic car jackings increase. He said 22 people he personally knew have been victims of car jacking in 2021. They are organized and setup drop off points to box the cars in. The 'passanger' then holds them at gun point and another person gets in the driver seat. Stolen phones and credit cards a…
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Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#28I was in Minneapolis a few months ago and grabbed a Lyft. I started talking with the driver about crime surges, mainly the dramatic car jackings increase. He said 22 people he personally knew have been victims of car jacking in 2021. They are organized and setup drop off points to box the cars in. The 'passanger' then holds them at gun point and another person gets in the driver seat. Stolen phones and credit cards a…
How is it possible to do this professionally without getting shot or run over? The first few victims I get. But after it becomes an identified pattern and makes the news people are gonna be on somewhat of a lookout or at least have it in the back of their mind that it's possible and the odds of your victim seeing the trap before you've got it complete go way up. Sure you can try and profile people and avoid the car w…
They are giving the impression that this is an organized crime issue and that these cars are being stolen for financial gain, but I live in Minneapolis and everything I’m hearing is that it is joyriding teenagers with guns. Everything about it is reckless, dangerous and scary - but I don’t think anyone is doing it “professionally” (and I’m skeptical that any organized “boxing in” is taking place).
And I know this next bit is going to come off as defensive - but I think it provides some context. I’m native to the upper Midwest, but I’ve spent a lot of time living in other large cities around the country. Take a look at the FBI violent crime data below.
Minnesota is a very low crime state and is coming off historically low crime. The current uptick in violent crime is real, but still doesn’t come close to the 90’s and lags significantly behind US average.
All that said, talking with people - including family - in neighboring communities and across the border in Wisconsin, you’d think Minneapolis is a burning, crime ridden hellhole where you can’t even walk down the street safely. There’s clearly some kind of political hay being made by that narrative.
https://crime-data-explorer.app.cloud.gov/pages/explorer/cri...
Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Just about everyone needs privacy rights and most care about those rights for themselves. I don't think that's true in practice, no. Most people take the "I have nothing to hide" approach, and, sadly, the lives of most people are so uneventful that that's actually true.
> the lives of most people are so uneventful that that's actually true. That's probably true. The issue is that people with something to hide, need the other people to hide their mundane stuff so that the people with things to hide, don't stand out.
Based on more than a handful of videos I have seen, the reason for having security cameras could be just as much about protecting you from police/the legal system as it is about protecting you for insurance purposes and for dissuading criminals.
Re: Edina Minnesota latest suburb to roll out homeowner surveillance camera program
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
How is it possible to do this professionally without getting shot or run over? The first few victims I get. But after it becomes an identified pattern and makes the news people are gonna be on somewhat of a lookout or at least have it in the back of their mind that it's possible and the odds of your victim seeing the trap before you've got it complete go way up. Sure you can try and profile people and avoid the car w…
They are giving the impression that this is an organized crime issue and that these cars are being stolen for financial gain, but I live in Minneapolis and everything I’m hearing is that it is joyriding teenagers with guns. Everything about it is reckless, dangerous and scary - but I don’t think anyone is doing it “professionally” (and I’m skeptical that any organized “boxing in” is taking place). And I know this nex…
I agree as well with this partially. I have mainly heard the statements along the lines. 'It's teenagers' executing the theft. From the wide spread and increasing amounts it seems to follow, more organized members are involved with what would be required next.
I won't pretend to state what happens to a stolen car. I have nothing but speculation and the obviously known facts. I can guess that given the targets are newer models of cars with at least one form or another of lowjack style tech. This does assume the crime is not spontaneously carried out, generally.
What happens after the 'more risk prone' portion is some level of organized crime and people using 'minors' to help deliver on this is my understanding.