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Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

economist.com

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Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#21

Post by WithinReason »

s_dev wrote: post #4

This is something many people in the EU simply don't get -- I don't get it. Germans have a basically a positive stereotype of being a scientific nation and all around clever lads -- this has enormous soft power and gives leverage to things like "Made in Germany" as a brand. This anti-nuclear stance in Germany is absolutely caustic to that projected image. It's absolutely insane they want to shut down Nuclear and repl…

In my mind, a nuclear power plant staffed with German engineers is the least likely to have a nuclear accident.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#22

Post by rizkeyz »

benjaminsuch wrote: post #8
s_dev wrote: post #4

This is something many people in the EU simply don't get -- I don't get it. Germans have a basically a positive stereotype of being a scientific nation and all around clever lads -- this has enormous soft power and gives leverage to things like "Made in Germany" as a brand. This anti-nuclear stance in Germany is absolutely caustic to that projected image. It's absolutely insane they want to shut down Nuclear and repl…

As a german, can't agree more. From what I get talking to people is, that they have an irrational fear of a nuclear holocaust and nuclear waste.

We live at the dawn of cyberterrorism, I'm glad we are stepping out of nuclear now.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#23

Post by ekianjo »

fock wrote: post #12
s_dev wrote: post #4

This is something many people in the EU simply don't get -- I don't get it. Germans have a basically a positive stereotype of being a scientific nation and all around clever lads -- this has enormous soft power and gives leverage to things like "Made in Germany" as a brand. This anti-nuclear stance in Germany is absolutely caustic to that projected image. It's absolutely insane they want to shut down Nuclear and repl…

could you tell me, how long Uranium reserves last? Climate change aside (which will kill us all), Uranium-based fission power plants are just not solving the problem at hand: We are using far too much energy and increasingly have depleted the cache earth history hid for us.

you have enough uranium to last for hundreds of years if not thousands.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#24

Post by chrisseaton »

fock wrote: post #12
s_dev wrote: post #4

This is something many people in the EU simply don't get -- I don't get it. Germans have a basically a positive stereotype of being a scientific nation and all around clever lads -- this has enormous soft power and gives leverage to things like "Made in Germany" as a brand. This anti-nuclear stance in Germany is absolutely caustic to that projected image. It's absolutely insane they want to shut down Nuclear and repl…

could you tell me, how long Uranium reserves last? Climate change aside (which will kill us all), Uranium-based fission power plants are just not solving the problem at hand: We are using far too much energy and increasingly have depleted the cache earth history hid for us.

> have depleted the cachet earth history hid for us

Not sure that word means what you think it means.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#25

Post by iqanq »

s_dev wrote: post #4

This is something many people in the EU simply don't get -- I don't get it. Germans have a basically a positive stereotype of being a scientific nation and all around clever lads -- this has enormous soft power and gives leverage to things like "Made in Germany" as a brand. This anti-nuclear stance in Germany is absolutely caustic to that projected image. It's absolutely insane they want to shut down Nuclear and repl…

No post body was provided.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#26

Post by locallost »

I'm used to seeing a lot of misinformation related to Germany and nuclear power, so here are some facts in advance:

1) coal use went way down since they decided to switch off the nuclear plants. people assume it was replaced by coal, but this is false

2) emissions are down

3) phase out of coal was started last year and is on schedule to last until 2038

4) renewable use is way way up

5) they are one of the largest exporters of electricity in Europe

There is no doubt that the next decade represents uncharted territory, but thus far they really moved the needle. Can it be done this way is a reasonable question, as are doubts. But an automatic dismissal is irrational in light of the evidence. Especially compared to e.g. the US which hasn't budged from 60% fossil fuels for electricity in the last decade.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#27

Post by addicted »

“Why areGermans so jittery about an extremely expensive source of power, that continuously gets more expensive with time, that has long term effects the likes of which another strong engineering country is still dealing with 10 years after their disaster, that even if it does solve their immediate power solutions will never be a global solution because Germany along with the handful of existing nuclear nations will, by treaty, severely punish any other country that tried to become nuclear”.

So, to rephrase, why are Germans jittery about a terribly expensive solution that they and a few handful of other countries won’t even allow to be a solution for the vast majority of the world where most people actually live and which can at the drop of a hat blow up the entire planet.

I’m entirely convinced that if the US didn’t subsidize so many people’s nuclear engineering education we wouldn’t even be having this discussion because it’s almost entirely self serving nuclear engineers who keep demanding that we invest in the most expensive source of renewable energy instead of the myriad of cheaper options.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#28

Post by ketzu »

emptyfile wrote: post #16
heckerhut wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. The numbers are such that Germany cannot go back on this. We are committed to the non nuclear path now. And that’s okay. We’re going to make up the lost technology leadership in nuclear with competency in renewables. It’s fine and not the end of world. I wouldn’t have done it the way Merkel did, I would’ve switched off coal first. But I understand why that wasn’t an option at the time. It’s what it is.

> But I understand why that wasn’t an option at the time. explain

There was no significant public will or movement to get out of coal 10 years ago. It was never even discussed.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#29

Post by speedgoose »

eckesicle wrote: post #9

In my opinion Europe's decommissioning of nuclear plants, particularly in Germany, is the greatest geopolitical blunder in recent history. The EU is now completely dependent on Russian goodwill to power their infrastructure for the next few decades, and have given up all leverage they had to push back on Russian power plays. At the very least they should've kept the plants operational and operating at minimum capacit…

Keeping the plants operational at minimum capacity mean having to pay for them but not being able to use them for real. I don't think it makes economical sense. Though the German energy mix already doesn't make much sense.

Re: Why Germans remain so jittery about nuclear power

#30

Post by hannob »

emptyfile wrote: post #16
heckerhut wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. The numbers are such that Germany cannot go back on this. We are committed to the non nuclear path now. And that’s okay. We’re going to make up the lost technology leadership in nuclear with competency in renewables. It’s fine and not the end of world. I wouldn’t have done it the way Merkel did, I would’ve switched off coal first. But I understand why that wasn’t an option at the time. It’s what it is.

> But I understand why that wasn’t an option at the time. explain

The renewables buildout was always tightly coupled with the nuclear phaseout in the political discourse.

The idea that you could've kept nuclear, still have the renewables buildout and close coal early wasn't a political position anyone in any relevant position was advocating for.

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