Earlier quoted context omitted.
So the current arrangement of service workers being paid slave wages and given disgusting conditions is working fine?
My three union jobs were service worker jobs; what are you trying to imply here?
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Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
301–310 of 411 posts
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#302Imputing altruistic morals to profit-seeking entities and then continually being surprised and offended when companies act shady puts employees in a pointlessly weak position. Instead, treat the relationship as adversarial and come ready for battle every day against the legal structure designed to exploit you for the benefit of distant shareholders. There is no shame in fighting for yourself. You are worth it.
> treat the relationship as adversarial and come ready for battle every day against the legal structure designed to exploit you for the benefit of distant shareholders Exploit you with industry leading pay and perks? Unions are designed to balance out monopolistic / low pay / highly geographical companies like large auto manufacturers or airlines. There is so much competitive hiring in tech, it’s one of the easiest c…
> Unions are designed to balance out monopolistic / low pay / highly geographical companies like large auto manufacturers or airlines.
Directors Guild of America says hello!
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#303A lot of people seem confused why a lot of tech people aren't pushing for unions. For me it's simple: Tech has brought me from near poverty to pretty darn wealthy. Why mess with that? Could a union help increase wages even more? Maybe. Are we being paid too little compared to our output? Maybe. But at the same time I'm being paid more than I could have possibly imagined before I entered the field.
Indeed. Also everyone seems to forget that the history of unions in the US is inseparable from mafia racketeering. To the point that the federal government had to break some of the power of unions in order to break up the effectiveness of mafia racketeering.
This is one of the anti-union talking points from documents produced by IRI (the firm Google has hired to fight unionization efforts) in a previous union-busting effort.
> “Talk about any bad experience you or others you know may have had with unions,” the document instructs managers. “Also talk about the union’s past. Tell employees about documented history of Mafia influence and corruption of unions. Tell employees examples where union leaders have embezzled money from their members’ pension and health insurance funds. Tell them about situations where unions have made promises and have not delivered.”
https://yaledailynews.com/blog/2007/03/14/hospital-document-...
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#304Earlier quoted context omitted.
There are things beyond compensation that individuals cannot easily negotiate by themselves. For example, a reasonable ask could be to never get contacted by boss or work colleagues (about work) outside of work hours (unless oncall, etc.). In the absence of group coordination that a union provides this work arrangement is simply out of reach for most.
A union won't help you get your own tailored work situation, where you enjoy never ever being contacted after hours. They'll work for a situation where everyone gets that, and everyone is treated the same. That's the whole point. Goodbye work flexibility for your entire company.
Well yeah that’s the idea. Things like “never being contacted after hours” only work if everyone agrees to it. If there are a few people on the team who “defect” by getting work flexibility and start pinging people at night, the whole culture quickly reverts to “it’s ok to ping people at night”.
You’ll be free to choose non-union jobs, it’s just there will now be an option for a “business hours only” workplace where there’s none now.
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#305Earlier quoted context omitted.
So the current arrangement of service workers being paid slave wages and given disgusting conditions is working fine?
I don't see how individual unions help solve this problem. A union that makes meaningful changes to conditions and wages at one employer would hobble that employer's ability to compete, they'd go out of business, and a non-unionized workforce/employer would replace them. This seems like a job for government and/or market forces. The latter actually have been working well recently near where I live, as the labor short…
Do you have examples of how unionization destroys the ability to compete? Because I know of tons of union jobs around where I live, and they routinely compete with non-union jobs. Many of the union companies are major players who have been around for decades, which suggests that a happy, well-treated workforce might actually be an advantage.
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#306A lot of people seem confused why a lot of tech people aren't pushing for unions. For me it's simple: Tech has brought me from near poverty to pretty darn wealthy. Why mess with that? Could a union help increase wages even more? Maybe. Are we being paid too little compared to our output? Maybe. But at the same time I'm being paid more than I could have possibly imagined before I entered the field.
Yes, but you are not the only person working for that company. I for one fight for the right of every employee of the company I work for to be treated fairly and greatly. Just because YOU have a good relationship with your company (or more so with your manager) doesn't mean everyone is on equal foot. I feel extremely uncomfortable when my coworkers are crying for help and all I show is indifference.
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#307Earlier quoted context omitted.
I also am having difficulty finding documentation for this, but I know it’s true. Many condo and apartment complexes around Google campuses have “preferred employer rates” that slash the rent for Googlers.
I have been at Google for many years, and the only time I have ever heard of this are certain corporate housing for long-term temps working in MTV and for a while there was some subsidized intern housing. If such rates exist, they are uncommon or not often talked about. There may be better proof out there, in which case you ought to provide it. But until I see something better, I am very skeptical.
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Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#308There's a valid argument to be made that unions do suck. You could call it informing people just as much as "convincing" them.
That argument should be made by a professor in their college lectures. Not as part of induction procedure to the company. It should be legal but it's actually hilarious that this happens in the US. It would be like a landlord mandating a tenant watch a video on why tenancy rights are a bad idea.
What's the issue with that? They present a lot of BS in company intro meetings. It's "drink the kool aid time" as far as I am concerned.
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#309Earlier quoted context omitted.
I also am having difficulty finding documentation for this, but I know it’s true. Many condo and apartment complexes around Google campuses have “preferred employer rates” that slash the rent for Googlers.
I have been at Google for many years, and the only time I have ever heard of this are certain corporate housing for long-term temps working in MTV and for a while there was some subsidized intern housing. If such rates exist, they are uncommon or not often talked about. There may be better proof out there, in which case you ought to provide it. But until I see something better, I am very skeptical.
It's possible these exist, but I'd expect they're a sense of risk-awareness on the part of business owners, not sponsored by any employer directly. If you know you'll have someone who makes >$ dollars and lives less than a mile from your condo/apartment complex, you probably have a very stable, long term leasee.
Re: Google Had Secret Project to ‘Convince’ Employees ‘That Unions Suck’
#310Earlier quoted context omitted.
That argument should be made by a professor in their college lectures. Not as part of induction procedure to the company. It should be legal but it's actually hilarious that this happens in the US. It would be like a landlord mandating a tenant watch a video on why tenancy rights are a bad idea.
What's the issue with that? They present a lot of BS in company intro meetings. It's "drink the kool aid time" as far as I am concerned.
>drink the kool aid time
That's slang for swallowing propaganda and committing suicide.