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Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

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Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#51

Post by Grustaf »

Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #5

Meanwhile our idiot city (Oxford, UK) is spending £1.2m on "Quickways", which are painted lines on existing roads... guaranteed to keep cyclists 0% safe. This in the face of national Government guidance in favour of physical segregation from cars. (Plans at https://letstalk.oxfordshire.gov.uk/quickway-cycle-route-oxf... : the promise of "segregation where possible" in reality means about 5% of the network.) It is rea…

A lot of bike paths here in Copenhagen are simply painted and it works fine, even for small kids.

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#52

Post by mathieuh »

lobochrome wrote: post #20
Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #5

Meanwhile our idiot city (Oxford, UK) is spending £1.2m on "Quickways", which are painted lines on existing roads... guaranteed to keep cyclists 0% safe. This in the face of national Government guidance in favour of physical segregation from cars. (Plans at https://letstalk.oxfordshire.gov.uk/quickway-cycle-route-oxf... : the promise of "segregation where possible" in reality means about 5% of the network.) It is rea…

I'm a road biker and would love fully separated bikeways wherever possible. The scheme in Milano sounds exciting and full of the right spirit. That being said, painted lines, in reality, do positively affect safety, both perceived (at least by me) and in accident statistics. Rethinking our cities towards multi-modal transportation will take time. I believe maximalist positions ("only physically separated bike lanes a…

I have the opposite opinion of painted-line bike paths: I'd rather they not be there at all. If they are there I feel forced to use them by drivers punishment passing me, despite the fact that the so-called bike lanes are full of glass, potholes and cars.

If they aren't there I feel like I get treated with more patience when I ride in my normal road position, about 75 cm from the kerb.

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#53

Post by lelandfe »

forgetfulness wrote: post #15
Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #5

Meanwhile our idiot city (Oxford, UK) is spending £1.2m on "Quickways", which are painted lines on existing roads... guaranteed to keep cyclists 0% safe. This in the face of national Government guidance in favour of physical segregation from cars. (Plans at https://letstalk.oxfordshire.gov.uk/quickway-cycle-route-oxf... : the promise of "segregation where possible" in reality means about 5% of the network.) It is rea…

NYC has, at least in Brooklyn, a quite extensive bike lanes network. It's of very inconsistent quality, besides workarounds that are tolerable given circumstance, like that the path cuts off at one point and resumes on the other lane in the street, the abundance of bike lanes that lack any separation at all from the main street makes it so morons use it as a place to stop their cars or trucks, and then you have to ma…

Neistat's Bike Lanes is a perennial classic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzE-IMaegzQ

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#54

Post by lbriner »

There is an issue that needs consideration, if you compare to Japan which has enormous cycle usage. Although it is good for air pollution, you end up seeing whole seas of cycles everywhere which is not nice in terms of the aesthetic nvironment. Go to a normal suburban train station and there might be 500+ bikes all in a massive area.

Better than a large car park but we don't get many large station car parks in the UK. At least with mass transit like buses and trains, the vehicle isn't parked anywhere for any length of time whereas most cycles have very low utilisation in terms of hours per day.

It is impossible without registration to know how many bikes are abandoned. Not sure if the authorities in Japan already have a system for dealing with that.

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#55

Post by pmontra »

Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #5

Meanwhile our idiot city (Oxford, UK) is spending £1.2m on "Quickways", which are painted lines on existing roads... guaranteed to keep cyclists 0% safe. This in the face of national Government guidance in favour of physical segregation from cars. (Plans at https://letstalk.oxfordshire.gov.uk/quickway-cycle-route-oxf... : the promise of "segregation where possible" in reality means about 5% of the network.) It is rea…

This is perhaps the most trafficked new bike path in Milan, going to the city center from North https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtBeEBgodCw

It was built in Spring/Summer 2020. You may start from 1:00 if you're in hurry, you'll get the idea. They moved the parking area towards the center to make way for a protected bike path. The road is narrower for cars but it was stop and go anyway (mostly stop).

Further North, on the way out from the city, they didn't move the parking area. They painted a line between the cars and the parking area.

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#56

Post by n-i-m-a »

altacc wrote: post #30
Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #5

Meanwhile our idiot city (Oxford, UK) is spending £1.2m on "Quickways", which are painted lines on existing roads... guaranteed to keep cyclists 0% safe. This in the face of national Government guidance in favour of physical segregation from cars. (Plans at https://letstalk.oxfordshire.gov.uk/quickway-cycle-route-oxf... : the promise of "segregation where possible" in reality means about 5% of the network.) It is rea…

I would be surprised if part of Milan's plan wasn't just to paint some bits of roads a different colour and call it a cycle path. These large initiatives tend to be a mix of solutions, from paint to dedicated cycle paths. This has happened pretty much anywhere a city has announced upgraded cycling infrastructure. Some cities ratio it better than others.

As they did last year... There was quite some adapting for the drivers then and still confusing for drivers not familiar with these streets. Newly painted lanes with width that would vary every 50-100 meters (or less), random taxi/bus stops and parking being interchanged with the bike lane... Not easy for the riders nor the drivers...

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#57

Post by masklinn »

gsliepen wrote: post #12
Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #5

Meanwhile our idiot city (Oxford, UK) is spending £1.2m on "Quickways", which are painted lines on existing roads... guaranteed to keep cyclists 0% safe. This in the face of national Government guidance in favour of physical segregation from cars. (Plans at https://letstalk.oxfordshire.gov.uk/quickway-cycle-route-oxf... : the promise of "segregation where possible" in reality means about 5% of the network.) It is rea…

In the Netherlands there are also roads with just a painted bike lane. The difference is that the whole bike lane is painted in a solid color (usually reddish). This gives a constant visual feedback to drivers. Because of the paint it is just ever so slightly raised and has a different texture than the regular asphalt, so there can be a noticable difference in sound when car tires go onto the bike lane. See for examp…

Cycle lanes are the subject of active and intense debate in the netherlands, and while they remain grandfathered (not sure they’re allowed for new roads) they are not the part of the recommendations.

Furthermore, the legal management of cycle lanes is a lot harsher in the netherlands: drivers are not allowed to drive, park, or stop in cycle lanes. Cycle lanes with solid lines can not be encroached on at all, while cycle lanes with dashed lines may be crossed or used to pass an obstacles.

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#58

Post by kawsper »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #31

BTW the next problem we have to solve after bike paths lacking in a city are showers lacking in office buildings.

I bike to work in -2 to ~30 degrees celcius, as long as you don't go really fast you don't really sweat that much in the climate of Denmark, it's mostly about pacing and not wearing too many layers.

I leave the fastpaced action for the trip home, just bring spare clothes in case of rain :-)

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#59

Post by [deleted] »

kasey_junk wrote: post #47
qwerty456127 wrote: post #31

BTW the next problem we have to solve after bike paths lacking in a city are showers lacking in office buildings.

Say what you want about leed certifications one very nice aspect of them is they require bike storage & showers in addition to all the green energy requirements.

[deleted]

Re: Milan confirms new cycling network linking 80% of the city to bike paths

#60

Post by pmontra »

lbriner wrote: post #54

There is an issue that needs consideration, if you compare to Japan which has enormous cycle usage. Although it is good for air pollution, you end up seeing whole seas of cycles everywhere which is not nice in terms of the aesthetic nvironment. Go to a normal suburban train station and there might be 500+ bikes all in a massive area. Better than a large car park but we don't get many large station car parks in the UK…

Bicycles locked wherever is possible are not nice to look at but to be fair the seas of parked cars along the streets are also not aesthetically nice and cars move maybe 2 or 3 hours per day, then most of them loot the streets. Abandoned cycle shares bicycles are definitely sad to look at and should be removed as soon as possible especially when they belong to a failed company. Disclaimer: I drive much more than I cycle.
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