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James Webb is fully deployed

nasa.gov

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Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#371

Post by dkural »

galacticaactual wrote: post #357
JohnBooty wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just want to make sure I understand. Your position is that they should have added significant complexity to a maneuver that was already the most complex of its kind. A maneuver with $10 billion and two decades of work on the line. In order to make the first 30 days of a 10+ year mission marginally more entertaining. You propose this while fully aware that the "entertainment" in question consists of things unfolding…

What a condescending reply. That 10 billion was funded by taxpayers, and the assertion that at the very least there should have been a possibility of those taxpayers seeing the fruits of their money through pictures instead of some intractable telemetry is a fair one.

No post body was provided.

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#372

Post by loonster »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #202
varajelle wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But L2 is just one point

That's an abstraction. In reality, what we call "L2" is an orbit around the L2 point. No shortage of room.

I was thinking since the point is so unstable, the orbit must be extremely small...

Boy was I wrong. The orbit is about the same size as the moon makes around the earth. [0] Its HUGE. We would run out of material to make satellites before we ever ran out of room.

[0] https://jwst.nasa.gov/content/about/orbit.html

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#373

Post by tomr_stargazer »

willis936 wrote: post #350
freeflight wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the telescope is aimed at the dark and away from the sun To be more specific; It's "parked" in an orbit [0] that constantly puts Earth between the sun and James Webb. So it's not only aimed away from the sun, Earth is also acting as a planetary scale sunscreen for it. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrange_point

Actually JWST orbits around L2 at appreciable altitude. The unique aspect of the orbit is that it is never in the shadow of the Earth or moon. It guarantees consistent solar power and thermal load. https://jwst-docs.stsci.edu/jwst-observatory-characteristics...

Wow. I’m an astronomer and somehow I never learned this! Thank you for the link!

Of course a solar powered satellite can’t be parked in the shade. Can’t believe I never thought about that.

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#374

Post by adventured »

WalterBright wrote: post #119
sailingparrot wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's a wrong assumption. Significant cost come from the assembly and testing of all the components itself, that you would have to redo entirely. Also if you were to build just 2 or 3 of them, you can't expect any economy of scale. On top of that, the operational cost of JWST is expected to be around 1B$ for it's lifetime, you could expect that to be similar for every single replica you have. And finally, you…

Assuming your figures are correct, you'll get double the data for another 30% cost. If you wait a month before launching #2, if problems appear in #1 (like the telescope mirror was ground improperly) it can be fixed in #2. The operational cost will not double. The same ground facility, equipment, and staff can manage both. If you're buying two identical launches, you can get a quantity discount. > the benefits of a s…

> Assuming your figures are correct, you'll get double the data for another 30% cost.

The debate over the cost to build another is largely moot. You'd struggle to find the people to do it for many reasons. The talent is even scarcer than the money.

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#375

Post by MichaelMoser123 »

I wonder if there are some aliens looking at this, and wondering if another advanced civilization has put this together (just like we were wondering with ʻOumuamua). To me James Webb looks definitely like alien technology, if it manages to pass 50 deployment stages, depending on 178 deployment mechanisms... The team working on this did an incredible job! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUAvXYW5bmI&t=195s

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#376

Post by croutonwagon »

dmead wrote: post #354
JohnBooty wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just want to make sure I understand. Your position is that they should have added significant complexity to a maneuver that was already the most complex of its kind. A maneuver with $10 billion and two decades of work on the line. In order to make the first 30 days of a 10+ year mission marginally more entertaining. You propose this while fully aware that the "entertainment" in question consists of things unfolding…

Literally every other nasa mission is filmed like this now. 10 billion and we can't even get visual confirmation it's doing well. And yes. Hubble being deployed was a big deal.

Not really. There are no "selfies" of voyagers, Dawn, New Horizons, Juno etc. T There ARE pictures/data from what these have produced. JWST will be no different.

Even Hubble didnt really have any of that that I am aware of. Most of the pictures of hubble itself are from servicing missions.

Sure you have some rover selfies on Mars, but thats not the sole purpose of the instruments, quite the contrary really.

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#377

Post by jjtheblunt »

daveslash wrote: post #204
jl6 wrote: post #192

More great news. Congratulations to all who have worked on the project. I understand the reasons for not putting a camera on or near the JWST, but I’m still a little sad that we’ll probably never get to see the thing in situ in all its operational glory. Maybe one day when it finally expires, we can launch a “sample return” mission to tow it back.

RE>> "I understand the reasons for not putting a camera on or near the JWST" What are the reasons? I'm sorry ~ I'm ignorant on the topic, but I'd love to learn more. Why/what are the reasons?

it might be "desense", that the running of electronics of certain sorts near the large detector has the effect of desensitizing it.

this is just a guess though.

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#378

Post by JohnBooty »

galacticaactual wrote: post #357
JohnBooty wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just want to make sure I understand. Your position is that they should have added significant complexity to a maneuver that was already the most complex of its kind. A maneuver with $10 billion and two decades of work on the line. In order to make the first 30 days of a 10+ year mission marginally more entertaining. You propose this while fully aware that the "entertainment" in question consists of things unfolding…

What a condescending reply. That 10 billion was funded by taxpayers, and the assertion that at the very least there should have been a possibility of those taxpayers seeing the fruits of their money through pictures instead of some intractable telemetry is a fair one.

    taxpayers seeing the fruits of their money through pictures
I've got great news for you! It's going to be taking pictures.

It's a telescope, you see.

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#379

Post by awb »

mywacaday wrote: post #238

What I love about this project is that I had an active worry about its success, very few things in life inspire that kind of emotion. Well done to all involved, a true lifetime achievement. Can't wait for the images!

The cost: 23 years and $10B

The benefit: “JWST’s instruments are designed to make discoveries across the spectrum of astronomy — ranging from the worlds and mini-worlds in our own solar system to alien planets circling distant stars, from the supermassive black hole at the center of our own Milky Way galaxy to the edge of the observable universe.” (https://www.geekwire.com/2021/high-cost-high-risk-high-hopes...)

Extremes on the cost/benefit helped create some extreme emotions, I agree!

Re: James Webb is fully deployed

#380

Post by abadger9 »

MichaelMoser123 wrote: post #375

I wonder if there are some aliens looking at this, and wondering if another advanced civilization has put this together (just like we were wondering with ʻOumuamua). To me James Webb looks definitely like alien technology, if it manages to pass 50 deployment stages, depending on 178 deployment mechanisms... The team working on this did an incredible job! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUAvXYW5bmI&t=195s

i'm sure they might when the light reaches them, given the context of planets in our neighborhood, probably in a few hundred/thousand years?
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