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California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

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Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#131

Post by bryanlarsen »

apendleton wrote: post #114
no_wizard wrote: post #4

> to fund a first-in-the-nation single-payer health-care system. This is key here. So instead of paying this out to a private insurance company I pay it in taxes, there by my actual change is net zero, in most cases. I have a feeling most reactions might be headline driven here. I think it’s worth doing the math on how much it costs you in healthcare coverage before really judging a book by its cover here. If my comp…

> my actual change is net zero, in most cases It's designed to be a progressive system, unlike current health insurance, so almost nobody's change will be net zero, even assuming the cost of providing the service is the same (which, who knows). Low-income earners can probably expect to pay considerably less, and high-income earners can expect to pay considerably more; only people right at the crossover point would ex…

Even better, on average it will be net zero. Since some high earners skew the average considerably, it will be net positive for a significant majority of taxpayers.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#132

Post by coolspot »

cliftonk wrote: post #72
no_wizard wrote: post #4

> to fund a first-in-the-nation single-payer health-care system. This is key here. So instead of paying this out to a private insurance company I pay it in taxes, there by my actual change is net zero, in most cases. I have a feeling most reactions might be headline driven here. I think it’s worth doing the math on how much it costs you in healthcare coverage before really judging a book by its cover here. If my comp…

Families with kids w/ under 200k combined income pay > 10% of their income in health insurance. Premiums for a decent plan with 2 adults + 1 kid is $20k a year.

SoCal Kaiser HMO 30 ($30 copay) for 2 adults and 2 kids is like $1k/month, paid before taxes.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#133

Post by Kye »

john_moscow wrote: post #59
qaq wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at housing availability hard to believe there is an actual net outflow from CA

There's an outflow of people willing to produce value, and an inflow of people ready to consume it. It will work just great until suddenly there's not that many value left to feed all the hungry mouths. And then the mouths will take pitchforks and go raid the nearby granary because that's where they think the food is. Only to find it empty because the people willing to actually produce food left long time ago. USSR h…

Did you get your entire understanding of economics from an Ayn Rand novel? The idea that there are givers and takers is a nonsense understanding. Even billionaires provide a little value, though not much. I also don't see how the people providing the bulk of value, mostly in retail/service, could afford to leave with billionaires taking all the remuneration from the labor of others.

Your analysis is complete bunk.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#134

Post by sam0x17 »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #60

California has a golden goose in the wealthy megacorporations and billionaires who live there. Every tax that California adds risks killing that golden goose. Tesla has already left as highly publicized, but others are too. Apple is building a billion-dollar campus in Austin, Texas. Oracle has moved its headquarters to Texas.

> Apple is building a billion-dollar campus in Austin, Texas

That they're already seriously regretting doing now that the promises of the remote economy are starting to be truly realized and the pandemic shows no end in sight. Billion dollar campuses are worth $0 in a fully remote economy. Turn them all into high quality public housing and move on. The office is dead.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#135

Post by oa2022 »

dillondoyle wrote: post #130
oa2022 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It works in the sense that I go to a private clinic when I have an issue. Likewise with the great public school system, where families pay 30k per year so they can avoid a public school

In most countries that have public care you can still do this, just like opting for private schools. Britain people buy private insurance for any additional services they want. But I don't think they usually get a tax incentives like private school does can in the US? https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tips/college-and-education/t...

If I get private healthcare and private education, and private pensions, I don't want to pay social security, thanks!

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#136

Post by sneak »

Dig1t wrote: post #90

Honestly this is a great sign IMO. Rather than forcing this kind of system on a nation-wide scale, something that would undoubtedly make a lot of people unhappy for a bunch of different reasons, we can trial this kind of system on a smaller scale and see how it goes. Obviously the good people of California are okay with paying high taxes, and this is just the kind of thing that the majority of CA people seem to want…

> Rather than forcing this kind of system on a nation-wide scale, something that would undoubtedly make a lot of people unhappy for a bunch of different reasons

California is nation-scale. You are still forcing this kind of system into a nation-amount of people.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#137

Post by subsubzero »

alexjray wrote: post #2

This is insane. People are already leaving the states in droves. If this passes they are literally shooting themselves in the foot.

Me and my Wife are already fed up with the high taxes here in CA currently and we get pretty much nothing for them. We are already planning on leaving CA for good as it makes zero financial sense given we can both work anywhere we want.

This potential tax hike would probably be the proverbial "nail in the coffin" to the state of CA. Just for us we would see our taxes go up the equivelent of doubling our mortgage payment, that is complete insanity and I would expect 80%-90% of all the high earners to flee the state causing its finances to drop off a cliff.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#138

Post by PaulDavisThe1st »

jppope wrote: post #10

The healthcare system in the United States is debatably one of the worst in the world. Cheers to California for trying to find a way to guarantee that all Californian's have access to the worlds worst healthcare system.

so many metrics for "good healthcare" and "bad healthcare", so a little expansion might be wise.

   * availability of a wide set of health procedures
   * median time to delivery of a given health procedure
   * outcomes from specific medical conditions
   * expected longevity, measured at various points at or after birth
   * cost of a given health procedure
   * median proximity to health care facilities
   * percentage of population without access to a given level of care
   * ...
The USA does well on some metrics and badly on others. The one metric which is totally unambigous is the absurd cost we pay both in aggregate and for specific medical procedures, along with the lack of access to healthcare among the population.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#140

Post by TheMagicHorsey »

Damn, this is gonna increase housing prices in Texas. Need to buy a house there quick, before all the Bernie brothers realize that US governments have no capability to execute. (You'd think they would have learned seeing the performance of the CDC with Covid, the State Dept. with Afghanistan, the Military with every campaign since WW2, NASA with the Space Shuttle and ISS, CA govt with unemployment and parental benefits over Covid, CA public schools, SF and LA local governments on nearly every metric.

Like these are failed institutions kept alive my the infinite tax payer money faucet. Turned this socialist into a capitalist in just 25 years. Government is absolutely hopeless on execution, but great on selling the vision to people with no experience in execution ... e.g. me at 25.

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