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California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

taxfoundation.org

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Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#61

Post by KZerda »

lax4ever wrote: post #11
no_wizard wrote: post #4

> to fund a first-in-the-nation single-payer health-care system. This is key here. So instead of paying this out to a private insurance company I pay it in taxes, there by my actual change is net zero, in most cases. I have a feeling most reactions might be headline driven here. I think it’s worth doing the math on how much it costs you in healthcare coverage before really judging a book by its cover here. If my comp…

Do you actually pay that much a year in insurance premiums? I don't live in CA, but I sure don't and my health coverage is pretty good. Keep in mind, this is also just the insurance premium, there's no talk of what co-pays or deductibles would be. In addition, your employer now has to pay more based on their gross receipts and if you make more than 150k a year you are paying even more.

Keep in mind as well that your employer probably pays a significant chunk of your insurance premiums right now, usually around 3/4 of the full costs of providing you insurance. This is what tends to bite people when they need COBRA coverage or other gap coverage when changing jobs, etc.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#62

Post by lukemercado »

jjoonathan wrote: post #29
after_care wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s very hard to do the math here. It’s largely invisible to me how much my employer is paying in health insurance premiums and it’s unknown that they will add that sum to my salary.

Which is why it's important to structure the "tax" to land in exactly the same place that health care costs land.

Yes, at first that is SUPER important, but wouldn't you ultimately want to fully decouple it from employers and just go to income taxes per individual for it?

The distinction is subtle, but in my mind having it structured as an individual paid income tax would yield better results for edge cases and not incentivize bad corporate behavior like running 1099 contractors instead of FTEs.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#63

Post by thatfrenchguy »

city17 wrote: post #36

I'm curious to see how a single payer system will work when the entire industry is profit-based. In most countries that with a single-payer healthcare system, all the medical institutions are either publicly funded or owned, or have some sort of cap on profits and monetary incentives. California as a single state with a single-payer funding having to then give all that money to profit-driver medical institutions seem…

Nah, lots of countries have single payer and for profit institutions. France has private PCPs and specialists, private hospitals and public hospitals.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#64

Post by kyrra »

no_wizard wrote: post #4

> to fund a first-in-the-nation single-payer health-care system. This is key here. So instead of paying this out to a private insurance company I pay it in taxes, there by my actual change is net zero, in most cases. I have a feeling most reactions might be headline driven here. I think it’s worth doing the math on how much it costs you in healthcare coverage before really judging a book by its cover here. If my comp…

I thought Vermont already tried single-payer healthcare?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/why-v...

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#66

Post by alexjray »

distrill wrote: post #21
alexjray wrote: post #2

This is insane. People are already leaving the states in droves. If this passes they are literally shooting themselves in the foot.

They really aren't. 100 people moving to a town in Idaho makes a big impact on that town in Idaho but is not felt at all by California.

38% decrease in people moving to California 12% increase in residents moving out of state last year.

In San Francisco Bay Area, it's even more stark. There was a 45% decrease in entrances from other states to the Bay Area and a 21% increase in residents leaving for other states.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#67

Post by wsinks »

no_wizard wrote: post #4

> to fund a first-in-the-nation single-payer health-care system. This is key here. So instead of paying this out to a private insurance company I pay it in taxes, there by my actual change is net zero, in most cases. I have a feeling most reactions might be headline driven here. I think it’s worth doing the math on how much it costs you in healthcare coverage before really judging a book by its cover here. If my comp…

Yeah, that was my exact reaction here.

"Doubling my taxes?!"

Oh... for a CA based single payer healthcare system that for the last 10-20 years people have continually asked for again and again? (Ok, maybe not just for CA, but... sometimes ya gotta start somewhere)

So now I'm back into the evaluation phase after headline whiplash. Will definitely consider the 'total compensation package'.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#69

Post by caslon »

trdtaylor1 wrote: post #25

Everyone who makes ~>250k would assumingly lose on this idea. Cost of insurance + maximum out of pocket would be smaller then the tax increase. I assume it would also be restricted to Cali without procuring a reciprocity agreement with a national insurer. If Dems managed to repeal the SALT deduction cap OR Cali just codes it to get around it (payroll tax direct to company only, and independent contractor business tax…

Median household income (in 2019 dollars), 2015-2019 $75,235

Per capita income in past 12 months (in 2019 dollars), 2015-2019 $36,955

https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/CA/INC110219

Your median Californian, and significantly above your median Californian, makes below $250k.

Re: California Considers Doubling Its Taxes

#70

Post by coding123 »

Guest42 wrote: post #30
qaq wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at housing availability hard to believe there is an actual net outflow from CA

Agreed, the numbers indicate a pretty significant exodus although it seems as though the supply has decreased and the pricing has increased on both rentals and homes for sale. Mathematically, the extent to which it happens and the duration don’t make much sense to me.

Rich FANG employees don't sell their bay area homes, they are just buying a second (and third) one to have their remote job location outside of the bay area. (Anecdata only- family members not me personally)
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