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Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

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Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#431
post #415
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn't that be a sign that the propaganda has been effective?

This is an example of the logical fallacy petitio principii (begging the question).

Alternatively, it could be taken as a honest question: do they actually want it because of the propaganda, or would they want it regardless of the propaganda?

Inferring tone from text is a bitch.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#433
post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly does this woke agenda push, if I may ask?

Quoted post unavailable.

"Woke" is a word, which describes/refers to a concept. The use of the word may be culturally and temporally specific (and that usage, like all use of language, may change over time), but the concept is one found in many different cultures and communities across time and space - put simply and broadly, the notion that one needs to "wake up" or "awaken" to what is actually happening. There are ways of describing this in many different languages. So while the current use of the word "woke" within the US may indeed be traced back to the African American community, the concept/idea has a much longer and broader history than that.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#434

I came to know about the Marvel movie military involvement from a youtube video essayist. I don't know whether it's good or bad. It's somewhere in the middle probably. Also every other country does the exact same thing afaik. The opposite of this would be potraying everything about the armed forces in a complete negative light. Now that won't be liked a lot I guess. The important thing here I believe is people should…

> Also every other country does the exact same thing afaik Not true. US, Russia, China, North Korea - sure. Can you name any other countries? Can you give examples for even a fraction of "all other countries"?

I am from India. There are plenty of bollywood movies doing the same.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking of good-vs-evil, do you also see WWII veterans and military history in the same light? They got into war that no one asked for. I cannot imagine if US and allies had lost WWII. It is simply unimaginable. Aside: I find the WWII era military training/propaganda videos pretty entertaining: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QgXuhv7-54

You’re proving the point, are you not? The Nazis were evil, but that doesn’t imply that the allies fought against the Axis powers because they were good . You can do the right thing for the wrong or neutral reasons. “US and allies”—that the US fought the whole war with the rest of the allies as support is another artifact of Hollywood’s portrayal of WWII. Although it’s understandable that there are less American movi…

The western front was more or less a sideshow. All of the big battles were in the East. The Soviets kept bottled up a German force fully half as big as were fielded on the whole western front, in a little peninsula of Latvia ("Courland Pocket"), for almost a year.

But the naval war in the Atlantic mattered. And, US supplies (particularly SPAM, and trucks, tires, and fuel) delivered through Iran were helpful late in the war.

But aside from naval work that denied Germany South American resources, the Soviets could have done the whole job on their own, and would have overrun all of Europe. In particular, there is no evidence that British and US area bombing achieved anything, although point attacks on rail locomotives did.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#436
As a person who grew up without a television at home (I was homeschooled in Canada), this is strikingly obvious. Even the differences in mentality and worldview between those who grew up watching American TV shows and those who didn't is immediately obvious to me within 5 minutes of having a casual conversation. One of the reasons I left Canada and moved to Eastern Europe is for the refreshing change in monoculture: I can have normal conversations with people whose minds have not developed in a Hollywood Matrix, whose entire cultural context is not based on popular TV references (or the tropes presented in them). Lots of people in post-Soviet countries don't watch American television, and it is very easy to tell when they do. I now strongly prefer European TV productions (especially older British and French stuff), because the American superpower-worship and military propaganda, and now wokeism, is positively cringeworthy.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#437
post #355
post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might be a language thing then. I'm reading through Urban Dictionary and most of them read to me like "I think I know the other person is dishonest or stupid". Let's take the most popular definition there: Woke - The act of being very pretentious about how much you care about a social issue Again, as a non-native English speaker I have to click through "pretentious". The most popular definition: Behaving in an attent…

Be careful about trusting Urban Dictionary too much. It can serve has a useful hint about what some slang means, but is often heavily biased towards the slang used by certain demographics and subcultures (and is vulnerable to brigading). It certainly is not a source of the "one true meaning" of a word. I am sure your language does have a word that is pretty similar to "pretentious" though it may not have all of the c…

Thanks for a thorough explanation and background!

I used Urban Dictionary for "pretentious" due to the OP explicitly referring to it to understand the meaning of woke.

But this got me intrigued now :) I still can't think of a phrase or word in Estonian that would convey the same (or even similar) meaning. I searched through a couple of dictionaries now and the translations provided there are really not useful. They mean either "complains a lot" or alternatively "has unreasonably high standards / is high maintenance", "braggy" and "pedantic". And these doesn't sound even remotely close to the English explanation of the word.. at all.

Any fellow Estonians wanna help me out here - is there a phrase or word that would capture the essence of "pretentious" in Estonian? :)

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#438
post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just watched Don't Look Up on Netflix and the propaganda was so thick it actually made the whole movie painful to watch. I suppose it's naive to think that old movies are propaganda-free. But I find myself missing the narratives I grew up with. The new ones are whiny, cynical and uninspiring. At least the old ones inspired me towards positive things.

The “propaganda” as you call it is called satire, and it’s actually the entire point of the film.

As it turns out, satire is a tool often used for propaganda.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#439
post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just watched Don't Look Up on Netflix and the propaganda was so thick it actually made the whole movie painful to watch. I suppose it's naive to think that old movies are propaganda-free. But I find myself missing the narratives I grew up with. The new ones are whiny, cynical and uninspiring. At least the old ones inspired me towards positive things.

I'm incredibly anti-Trump and I still fully agree with you. But I don't think the problem was that it was so "thick" so much as that it was so poorly done. Instead of being funny, it just reminded me of school bullies and general idiots, and was far too easy to write to be good satire.

School bullies and general idiots is a good way to put it. It felt like it was written by my 7th grade self.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#440
post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just watched Don't Look Up on Netflix and the propaganda was so thick it actually made the whole movie painful to watch. I suppose it's naive to think that old movies are propaganda-free. But I find myself missing the narratives I grew up with. The new ones are whiny, cynical and uninspiring. At least the old ones inspired me towards positive things.

The “propaganda” as you call it is called satire, and it’s actually the entire point of the film. Propaganda != opinion that you disagree with

As it turns out, satire is a tool often used for propaganda.

And I didn't say I disagree with the point they wanted to make. It just seems like a point made so poorly it was painful to watch.

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