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Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

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Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#11
“[George] Creel urged [Woodrow] Wilson to create a government agency to coordinate "not propaganda as the Germans defined it, but propaganda in the true sense of the word, meaning the 'propagation of faith.'"”: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Committee_on_Public_Informatio...

"Creel later published his memoirs of his service with the CPI, 'How We Advertised America', in which he wrote:

“In no degree was the Committee an agency of censorship, a machinery of concealment or repression. Its emphasis throughout was on the open and the positive. At no point did it seek or exercise authorities under those war laws that limited the freedom of speech and press. In all things, from first to last, without halt or change, it was a plain publicity proposition, a vast enterprise in salesmanship, the world's greatest adventures in advertising… We did not call it propaganda, for that word, in German hands, had come to be associated with deceit and corruption. Our effort was educational and informative throughout, for we had such confidence in our case as to feel that no other argument was needed than the simple, straightforward presentation of the facts.”"

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#12
post #6

The other country that is doing this at Hollywood scale is China, and it’s not just their ‘only popular in China’ movies like Wolf Warrior (1 and 2). Some scenes: https://youtu.be/g7y36UIRAjo IP Man 4, which is more well known to western audiences: https://youtu.be/OlW2VphUNd4 https://youtu.be/JFmaPK0JyVQ You get the idea. Americans make movies where America good, everyone bad. China is now making movies where China…

Another country that comes to mind is India - but I've never been enough of a Bollywood fan to be able to make any assessment on this topic. But it's a very effective tool to shape public opinion. I'm fairly certain without the overwhelmingly heroic portrait of (members of) the military, the public would be more inclined to question the huge investments that go into warfare. Particularly the display of highly achieve…

Pretty much. It’s no different that glorifying Gordon Gekko in Wallstreet.

Michael Douglas on why he doesn’t get why Gekko was an inspiration:

https://youtu.be/I8ruk8wjhuQ

We’re all vulnerable to this. Just here in tech we’ve deified the guy in a t-shirt/hoodie (zucks of the world) or mythical 10x programmers, built up and tore down people like Adam Neumann, all caricatures.

Propaganda works sadly.

With respect to war, it takes observing a war play out to realize how stupid it actually is. It took Americans 20 years of just watching Iraq/Afghanistan to conclude all that nationalism stuff is just not worth it at all. I don’t know how it’s all going to play out in the next 50 years, but I’m pretty sure in the aftermath of any American/Chinese conflict the conclusion of america-bad by the Chinese and China-bad by the Americans will just seem quite silly also.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#13

Once this was pointed out, I can't unsee it. It's kind of ruined movies that involves the military or military equipment for me, since it can be really obvious when creators toe the line for the military. When I see military equipment my gut reaction is to anticipate the other shoe dropping, and to look for shoehorned hero worship or some good-versus-evil plot point.

Speaking of good-vs-evil, do you also see WWII veterans and military history in the same light? They got into war that no one asked for. I cannot imagine if US and allies had lost WWII. It is simply unimaginable.

Aside: I find the WWII era military training/propaganda videos pretty entertaining: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QgXuhv7-54

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#14
one graphic that stuck with me, that I saw a few years ago is this one (https://imgur.com/svsB0Ub) (question being: which nation, according to you, contributed most to the defeat of Germany?"

Being German and having Russian relatives the perspective on the war on the continent has always been interesting to me. The sheer scale and brutality of the Eastern front, the war crimes and death (The Soviet Union lost more than 15% of its population!) is astonishing.

I don't think popular media reflects this at all, not even necessarily maliciously or as propaganda intentionally. But that disconnect between the reality, and the recognition of it in Russia itself, has had vastly negative consequences when it comes to other countries trying to understand Russia even today. (and I suppose it's not by accident that in Germany for example, often only elder statesmen point this out)

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#15
post #11

“[George] Creel urged [Woodrow] Wilson to create a government agency to coordinate "not propaganda as the Germans defined it, but propaganda in the true sense of the word, meaning the 'propagation of faith.'"”: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Committee_on_Public_Informatio... "Creel later published his memoirs of his service with the CPI, 'How We Advertised America', in which he wrote: “In no degree was the Committee a…

Is he... advertising for America in a quote about it? This is some meta stuff.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#16

Once this was pointed out, I can't unsee it. It's kind of ruined movies that involves the military or military equipment for me, since it can be really obvious when creators toe the line for the military. When I see military equipment my gut reaction is to anticipate the other shoe dropping, and to look for shoehorned hero worship or some good-versus-evil plot point.

Americans love that stuff though, it’s not necessarily propaganda forced down our throats. We’d still want to see the badass, all American commando on a 100 kill streak.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#17
I don't know anything about running a country but propaganda is something everyone does because it makes sense. Can't blame them.

I always (as an adult) assumed the countless war movies and cop TV shows are just that.

That said, a few years ago I stumbled upon some hideous cover of Offspring's gone away. Someone had turned that tune into a cheesy pop tune and made the video about young beautiful housewife and mother getting informed that her darling was killed in line of duty. No way some music production company just decided to do that on its own. Man, it was bad

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#18
post #6

The other country that is doing this at Hollywood scale is China, and it’s not just their ‘only popular in China’ movies like Wolf Warrior (1 and 2). Some scenes: https://youtu.be/g7y36UIRAjo IP Man 4, which is more well known to western audiences: https://youtu.be/OlW2VphUNd4 https://youtu.be/JFmaPK0JyVQ You get the idea. Americans make movies where America good, everyone bad. China is now making movies where China…

Another country that comes to mind is India - but I've never been enough of a Bollywood fan to be able to make any assessment on this topic. But it's a very effective tool to shape public opinion. I'm fairly certain without the overwhelmingly heroic portrait of (members of) the military, the public would be more inclined to question the huge investments that go into warfare. Particularly the display of highly achieve…

>Another country that comes to mind is India - but I've never been enough of a Bollywood fan to be able to make any assessment on this topic.

Curious why India came to mind especially if you are not able to make an assessment of this topic as you put it.

Re: Pentagon and CIA shaped thousands of Hollywood movies into effective propaganda

#19

The other country that is doing this at Hollywood scale is China, and it’s not just their ‘only popular in China’ movies like Wolf Warrior (1 and 2). Some scenes: https://youtu.be/g7y36UIRAjo IP Man 4, which is more well known to western audiences: https://youtu.be/OlW2VphUNd4 https://youtu.be/JFmaPK0JyVQ You get the idea. Americans make movies where America good, everyone bad. China is now making movies where China…

> The other country that is doing this at Hollywood scale is China

The difference being that while state propaganda has infected Hollywood it does not wholly control Hollywood. You’d be hard pressed to find any rough equivalent to Apocalypse Now, Full Metal Jacket, All the President’s Men, or The Post etc in China.

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