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Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

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Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#741

Post by torstenvl »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #739
torstenvl wrote: post #736

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just reviewed that Wikipedia page, and it seems accurate to my account. May I suggest you re-read it? It had nothing to do with the level of taxes, but with the insistence on following the urban mercantile paradigm, and, when farmers couldn't, forcibly taking their land from them. "The economy during the American Revolutionary War was largely subsistence agriculture.... Some residents in these areas had few assets…

> I just reviewed that Wikipedia page, and it seems accurate to my account. May I suggest you re-read it? You didn't actually give an account. But the quote you pulled describes farmers being taxed at a level they are incapable of paying. It appears that you would like to use that to support the claim "it had nothing to do with the level of taxes", somehow. You'd need to explain how.

I did, and in explicit detail. You're misreading the text, which is about a qualitative issue, not a quantitative one. It has nothing to do with level of taxation but with enforcing an urban mercantile paradigm of taxation, one that was literally impossible to meet and for which failure to meet it resulted in execution by starvation.

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#742

Post by thaumasiotes »

torstenvl wrote: post #741
thaumasiotes wrote: post #739

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I just reviewed that Wikipedia page, and it seems accurate to my account. May I suggest you re-read it? You didn't actually give an account. But the quote you pulled describes farmers being taxed at a level they are incapable of paying. It appears that you would like to use that to support the claim "it had nothing to do with the level of taxes", somehow. You'd need to explain how.

I did, and in explicit detail. You're misreading the text, which is about a qualitative issue, not a quantitative one. It has nothing to do with level of taxation but with enforcing an urban mercantile paradigm of taxation, one that was literally impossible to meet and for which failure to meet it resulted in execution by starvation.

Being taxed a certain amount of silver is just as much of an issue of levels as being taxed a certain amount of wheat. Assessed taxes were much more expensive than the farmers were able to pay. It doesn't matter what currency the taxes are assessed in. What matters is that the amount is too high.

Compare what the farmers said their problem was:

> A farmer identified as "Plough Jogger" summarized the situation at a meeting convened by aggrieved commoners:

>> I have been greatly abused, have been obliged to do more than my part in the war, been loaded with class rates, town rates, province rates, Continental rates, and all rates ... been pulled and hauled by sheriffs, constables, and collectors, and had my cattle sold for less than they were worth ... The great men are going to get all we have and I think it is time for us to rise and put a stop to it, and have no more courts, nor sheriffs, nor collectors nor lawyers.

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#743

Post by bobsil1 »

imgabe wrote: post #625
bobsil1 wrote: post #553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then we should rebrand away from the slaver-drafted constitution to the Free States of America, a fourth founding after the original, post-Civil War and Civil Rights Movement. That would match what we actually have, a multiethnic democracy welcoming global talent. Giving residents of Wyoming 70× the Senate voting power of any Californian is a joke.

Not a joke. It was the intent that populous states should not be able to steamroll less populous states in the Senate.

It was a deal sweetener. The federation flourished, renegotiate the terrible deal. States are artificial units. One person, one vote.

The intent of a bunch of folks who kept people chained up in barns is irrelevant, the intent of the 1700s circumstances is irrelevant. We're heading to 30% of Americans controlling 68% of Senate in '40, minority rule by rural white folks. This veneration of the parchment as a religious text is just an excuse to not use our brains to solve present-day problems.

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#744

Post by lazyasciiart »

pengaru wrote: post #483
_muff1nman_ wrote: post #477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is still really bad advice. There was a recent instance not a year ago where folks were stuck with 3 feet of snow at night on an interstate interchange. Yes there was a hotel not a mile from where they were but getting out of your car to cross the interstate in 3 feet of snow is a great way to get hit or get lost in the blizzard and get some good hypothermia. Compare this to staying in their car where they were…

For every anecdote you can provide of someone being careless on foot I can find multiple instances of a stopped vehicle being smashed into on a highway. Now we even have the pleasure of anticipating Tesla Autopilot to plow into us while stopped on the shoulder, apparently made even more likely if there's an emergency vehicle present.

> They found that 95 percent of these inconspicuous-vehicle crashes occur when a vehicle traveling down the roadway collides with a stationary one. However, more than half the deaths and almost 1 in 5 serious injuries occur when a vehicle strikes a pedestrian who is leaving, working on, or returning to a stopped vehicle. On average, this type of crash kills 300 pedestrians a year, a number that has risen by more than a quarter since 2014.

You are much safer sitting in a car on the highway shoulder than getting out of your car to walk to safety. https://www.iihs.org/news/detail/stopped-vehicle-crashes-res...

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#745

Post by lazyasciiart »

onecommentman wrote: post #541
_muff1nman_ wrote: post #494

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't disagree that sometimes it makes sense to get out of your vehicle if the road is all iced up and one is worried about a trucker crushing into you due to fog. Rather I'm more refuting the following statement: > unless you're truly in no mans land without any reachable alternatives for shelter, it's best to lock up the vehicle with a note on the dash and make your way to a shelter out of harms way The presence…

If there is this much confusion in a online community like this about what to do in such situations, either a more thorough study needs to be done by the Feds or a better job communicating what definitive study results recommend, with easy rules of thumb like “if you can see the lights of a shelter on the road from your vehicle and you haven’t seen a vehicle on the road in the last hour, then walk to the shelter’.

It's not confusion. One person is determinedly wrong. There is an easy rule of thumb: stay in your car.

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#746

Post by lazyasciiart »

Spare_account wrote: post #646
pengaru wrote: post #483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For every anecdote you can provide of someone being careless on foot I can find multiple instances of a stopped vehicle being smashed into on a highway. Now we even have the pleasure of anticipating Tesla Autopilot to plow into us while stopped on the shoulder, apparently made even more likely if there's an emergency vehicle present.

You've drifted off topic, and started giving advice about "vehicle broken down on active highway" which isn't the scenario being discussed. Yes, getting off the highway makes sense if you are in a disabled vehicle on an active highway, assuming there is something solid to shield you from the vehicles/debris that goes flying when your car is hit. No, getting out of your car in a winter storm when all traffic is halted…

Getting out of your car on an active highway is actually much more likely to kill you than staying in it - you instantly go from a big, strong noticeable metal cage (hopefully with flashing lights on) to a small, soft, very fragile person. People who don't see a car on the shoulder also don't see a person walking.

https://www.iihs.org/news/detail/stopped-vehicle-crashes-res...

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#747

Post by imgabe »

R0b0t1 wrote: post #715
imgabe wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They already live in the US. They shouldn't have to move anywhere to exercise their rights as US citizens.

They're already able to exercise their rights. As they don't live in a state they don't get to vote in state elections. The land was set aside for federal use, living in it and then complaining you don't live in a state seems insane.

> The land was set aside for federal use, living in it and then complaining you don't live in a state seems insane.

People have been living in it since the beginning. The land that they live on is not owned by the Federal government. It's owned by the people who live there (or their landlords). They paid for it. They pay property taxes on it. If the Federal government wants them to move, the government can pay them whatever amount is necessary to entice them to move. Otherwise, they deserve the same right to a voice in Congress that every other US citizen has.

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#748

Post by motorist_hacker »

weberer wrote: post #721
motorist_hacker wrote: post #637

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought you’re not supposed to downvote based solely on disagreement?

True, but it always seems to happen when people discuss politics.

No post body was provided.

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#749

Post by motorist_hacker »

barneygale wrote: post #230
weberer wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes the majority of people just disagree with you. It doesn't always have to be some conspiracy.

Because the readership of HN is mostly Americans who can't imagine not driving. The knee-jerk against public transport is pathetic and predictable.

No post body was provided.

Re: Motorists have been stranded on a major interstate in Virginia since last night

#750

Post by [deleted] »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #647
joejerryronnie wrote: post #619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s why they should consider annexation by Maryland.

I hadn't heard the annexation argument before, I suppose the fairest way would be to have an election in DC and people would vote on whether they wanted to be an independent state or part of Maryland, and whichever was chosen would be the way to go. I personally would expect they would want to be their own state, but who knows? If on the other hand people feel the choose their own state is very likely and Maryland un…

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