No Way to Grow Up • Hacker News Board

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#661

Post by quadrifoliate » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 5:44 PM UTC

sanedigital wrote: post #626

quadrifoliate wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In that case, shouldn't it be enough for everyone to return to work? I wonder why top companies in the S&P 500 are delaying return to work then. Clearly they must be operating under the same mysterious constraints that are keeping schools closed.

Top companies in the S&P 500 are delaying return to work because many tried it and were met with absolute mutiny. The vast majority of people got a taste of the remote life and don't want to return.

> The vast majority of people got a taste of the remote life and don't want to return.

Certainly this couldn't be the case for teachers teaching remotely – they probably enjoy their 10 hour workdays where they are standing most of the time and wearing a mask.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#662

Post by zepto » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 5:44 PM UTC

xboxnolifes wrote: post #657

zepto wrote: post #634

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only times we don't quantify things is when we cannot. Just because something has increased recently doesn’t mean there is an inbuilt human tendency for it. For example the wearing of lounge suits for business is a modern development. I don’t think you are going to claim that means there was a ‘human tendency’ for lounge suits all along.

> Just because something has increased recently doesn’t mean there is an inbuilt human tendency for it. Sure, but that wasn't my point. I was just showing the flaw in logic of the two quotes given. My original claim was not that we definitely quantify when we can, but that the reasonings given do not support your claim.

Sure but the reasonings don’t support the opposing claim, and that’s all that matters for this purpose. I don’t need to prove that we don’t have a built in tendency, only, that there is no proof that we do.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#663

Post by zepto » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 5:47 PM UTC

xboxnolifes wrote: post #658

zepto wrote: post #638

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you think of a historical period in the distant part where there is evidence of a preference for quantification? It seem like you are simply assuming that was present.

Assuming we are talking about innate and not cultural qualities: If I do not assume we optimize for the quantifiable, I must assume either (1) we optimize for the unquantifiable, (2) we do not favor one way or the other (innately), or (3) human nature has changed over a very short (few thousand year) time period. I was trying to rule out (1). (3) Seems pretty easy to rule out purely on our understanding of evolution.…

‘Tax law’ is not a historical period, nor is it evidence of a preference for quantification in general.

Given your apparent desire to be logical about this, it seems almost absurd that you would give this answer.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#664

Post by SuoDuanDao » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 5:48 PM UTC

watwut wrote: post #584

SuoDuanDao wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given how many gun deaths are suicide I wouldn't be surprised if it's a result of social isolation in response to Covid. I strongly agree with your second point... I'm all for a longer exploratory phase of life before people settle on a career, but that seems like it should involve a more gradual adoption of adult responsibilities, not delaying them ever more.

Suicides went down during Covid.

Wow, you're right! I find that quite counterintuitive, I wonder what the mechanism was.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#665

Post by fundad » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 5:57 PM UTC

School-Cotton wrote: post #581

fundad wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Giving up is the long term plan, what makes it worse if your new friends are there already? Is it more comfortable to wait for your current friends to decide that it’s not worth it to social distance so they socialize more? BTW School is open, kids are in-person. Indoor masking is here to stay wherever there are humans.

> Indoor masking is here to stay wherever there are humans. Huh? Indoor mask usage is low to zero in many parts of the US (and I assume the rest of the world too).

I should say "wherever most humans live". Here in the states, businesses within city limits require masking except for last June and July. Are the many parts you are talking about the low-population outskirts that never required masking? That's true I guess and they add up to a lot of people and businesses but not compared to where most of the population lives.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#666

Post by smm11 » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 6:12 PM UTC

rdtwo wrote: post #290

smm11 wrote: post #243

This is all we need. I have two kids just out of college, and they already have the attitude that they're defeated, the world is out to get them, if everyone older would just die, why can't we buy a new car for $4000 or a house for $20K?

Try multiplying by 10-20…

Yeah, just like wages.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#667

Post by yupper32 » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 6:22 PM UTC

blindmute wrote: post #653

yupper32 wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they're still around, legally. I said they're not really on the table because the vast majority of experts are still saying not to gather in large groups. You have to go out of your way to ignore those experts in order to go to these concerts and events.

Do you generally take no responsibility for your happiness and life trajectory, merely marching to orders from faceless strangers, or is that a recent development?

When a doctor tells you to keep off your feet and go to x weeks of physical therapy, do you ignore them because it won't make you happy?

When a doctor tells you to take an antibiotic until the bottle is empty, do you ignore them because you've started to feel fine after half the bottle?

When a doctor tells you that you need to lose 50lbs, which will significantly change your lifestyle and in the short-term make you unhappy, do you ignore them?

I don't ignore them. I listen to them, and follow their advice. Is this me merely marching to orders from strangers? Is this me taking "no responsibility for [my] happiness and life trajectory"?

Why is this Covid situation any different?

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#668

Post by tonymet » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 6:24 PM UTC

_skzr wrote: post #519

tonymet wrote: post #450

what did everyone expect to happen? There were plenty sounding this alarm early on in lockdown.

Anyone sounding this alarm, or any other anti-lockdown alarm, was instantly labeled a “Right wing nut” if you recall

true. good to see we've opened up to contrarians. oh wait…

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#669

Post by tester756 » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 6:25 PM UTC

WalterBright wrote: post #226

cjaybo wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure you've heard of prerequisites, but maybe you haven't encountered any questionable requirements in the classes you took at the schools you attended? Personally, I had to take classes like "Ancient Eastern Civilizations" while pursuing a degree in Audio Production. So while the term "useless" is a bit strong, I understand where they're coming from.

Caltech had a requirement for classes in social studies. This was a rather broad category, and included things like language, history, and even accounting. So there wasn't any reason for me to select a useless class. There were specific required classes that I didn't like, but they weren't useless. Prerequisites, of course, prevent one from wasting the professor's time from unprepared students.

>There were specific required classes that I didn't like, but they weren't useless.

Sure, course is never 100% useless, but when in one course you can learn "10 things" and on this one you can learn "1 thing" and have to spend similar amount of time on them meanwhile you're working full time, studying on weekends and trying to learn other things for your job/career, then things are tricky and you gotta pick - you put effort into some classes that aren't really efficent or maybe some OSS side project?

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#670

Post by SuoDuanDao » Wed, Jan 05, 2022, 6:26 PM UTC

bpodgursky wrote: post #47

stathibus wrote: post #10

In 30 years these kids will be running the world. I can only hope they'll understand why this happened to them, so the next generation will be a bit wiser.

Unfortunately, through advances in medical technology, the 70 year olds who run the world right now will probably still be running the world in 30 years.

The 'elites are harvesting children's adrenal glands to extend their lifespans' story is of course absurd and over the top, but I think we recognise it on a mythological level as a useful metaphor for our times. Probably why we frame covid measures as a decision of harming the very young or the very old.