Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

prnewswire.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

211–220 of 388 posts

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#211

Post by adam_arthur »

redanddead wrote: post #200
adam_arthur wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an article about allegations of anti-competitive behavior, and China has just spent a year enacting many new rules to foster competition among their tech companies. In many areas they went too far, and their approach to enacting the rules led to mass, unnecessary fear, but the spirit behind a lot of the changes was good. e.g. Alibaba can't ban links to competitors within their social apps. Apple does not allo…

I know nobody asked me, but personally I think your POV is right. I was listening to this podcast the other day about just this and the impression I got was "Wow, this may be good for the average Chinese person", I'm talking exclusively about the drive to enhance protections for citizens. https://podtail.com/podcast/caixin-global-podcasts/china-sto... It's narrated by an Asian-American guy, the article is written by…

I'll check it out!

Yes, I'm no fan of China's authoritarian nature, but the rules they are enacting must be judged on their own merits. And frankly, many of them are appropriate and coming from the perspective of increasing competition.

Basic economics implies that increased competition is good for the consumer.

The place where china really misstepped was doing everything suddenly and abruptly, which sparked tons of fear and scared investor capital away from their companies.

This part is a bad outcome due to increased cost of financing/debt for their companies, less competitive on engineer comp due to lowered share price and so on.

They could have done the same regulations but with much more forward notice and detailed their thinking rather than handing down abrupt decrees

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#212

Post by sigzero »

phkahler wrote: post #206
dpark wrote: post #17

”The complaint claims that the means used to effectuate the non-compete agreement included; (1) Google would share it's search profits with Apple; (2) Apple would give preferential treatment to Google for all Apple devices; (3) regular secret meetings between the executives of both companies; (4) annual multi-billion-dollar payments by Google to Apple not to compete in the search business; (5) suppression of the comp…

>> Except for #6, this is literally “Google pays Apple to be the default search provider.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payola

Did you even read that link? It does not apply.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#213

Post by 0xB31B1B »

null_object wrote: post #199

I cannot get over how much moaning and whinging people on HN do about supposedly not being able to choose their search-engine on iOS "without jail-breaking" their device when simply switching to another browser like iCab Mobile means they can choose absolutely any search engine they want in addition to the 25 that are included by default . For goodness sake do the minimum amount of research before squealing helplessl…

Defaults matter, and defaults encode the behavioral choices of like 80% of users. The downstream effects of this are that the default options have the most support. Its totally rational to complain about a bad default option.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#214

Post by Daffodils »

progman32 wrote: post #154
the-dude wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please tell me how ( I don't want the extension ). I go to preferences -> search. Then to 'Default search engine', which gives me a combo which gives me Google/Bing/eBay/Wikipedia. But I can not add anything to the combo. Further down, there is 'One-Click Search Engines' which contain the same options. No button to add one. Below is a 'Find more search engines' link which leads me to the plugins page.

Not op, but if you go to kagi.com and look in the search bar (edit: Firefox's own built in search bar) you'll see a little green plus over the magnifying glass. Click it and you'll see an option to add it to the search engine list.

Just to add to this, in firefox, you can use the extension "Add custom search engine"[1] and you can add any search engine to your firefox search engine list, and to the address bar. Another benefit of using this, you can access your saved preferences while searching from the address bar. DDG, Startpage, Kagi all give you a bookmarklet URL which you can add through this extension.

[1] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/add-custom-se...

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#215

Post by sigzero »

onion2k wrote: post #57
dpark wrote: post #17

”The complaint claims that the means used to effectuate the non-compete agreement included; (1) Google would share it's search profits with Apple; (2) Apple would give preferential treatment to Google for all Apple devices; (3) regular secret meetings between the executives of both companies; (4) annual multi-billion-dollar payments by Google to Apple not to compete in the search business; (5) suppression of the comp…

The alternative option seems to be that Apple is for some reason required to use their position to enter the search market. Why is that the alternative? No one is saying Apple have to provide their own search engine; people are suggesting Mac products should give the user a clear choice. A much more obvious alternative is that Apple (or any OS provider for that matter) shouldn't be able to sell the default search eng…

> people are suggesting Mac products should give the user a clear choice.

People can suggest all they want. Apple doesn't have to take that suggestion. Apple doesn't have to give you the ability to add search engines period. They give 5 choices currently from what I have read. They can also take money for making one of those the default. None of that is illegal.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#216

Post by sigzero »

hugh-avherald wrote: post #176
dpark wrote: post #17

”The complaint claims that the means used to effectuate the non-compete agreement included; (1) Google would share it's search profits with Apple; (2) Apple would give preferential treatment to Google for all Apple devices; (3) regular secret meetings between the executives of both companies; (4) annual multi-billion-dollar payments by Google to Apple not to compete in the search business; (5) suppression of the comp…

Apple is not obliged to enter the search market. But Google can't engage in illegal anti-competitive conduct.

Which they are not on iOS.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#217

Post by [deleted] »

null_object wrote: post #199

I cannot get over how much moaning and whinging people on HN do about supposedly not being able to choose their search-engine on iOS "without jail-breaking" their device when simply switching to another browser like iCab Mobile means they can choose absolutely any search engine they want in addition to the 25 that are included by default . For goodness sake do the minimum amount of research before squealing helplessl…

[deleted]

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#218

Post by sigzero »

CobrastanJorji wrote: post #36

Here's the complaint: https://www.docketalarm.com/cases/California_Northern_Distri... The putative class they're suing to represent is apparently "All consumers and businesses who paid Google to place advertising on Google search in the United States since January 1, 2005." I think the basic argument is "Apple might have created a competing search engine business, but Google paid them not to, which hurt people buying…

That is a totally BS argument. It needs to be thrown out.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#219

Post by Retric »

0xB31B1B wrote: post #213
null_object wrote: post #199

I cannot get over how much moaning and whinging people on HN do about supposedly not being able to choose their search-engine on iOS "without jail-breaking" their device when simply switching to another browser like iCab Mobile means they can choose absolutely any search engine they want in addition to the 25 that are included by default . For goodness sake do the minimum amount of research before squealing helplessl…

Defaults matter, and defaults encode the behavioral choices of like 80% of users. The downstream effects of this are that the default options have the most support. Its totally rational to complain about a bad default option.

On the other hand, I did change the default iOS browser easily. However, it would have been annoying to have a list of hundreds of options to choose from rather than the major ones.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#220

Post by bufferoverflow »

0xB31B1B wrote: post #213
null_object wrote: post #199

I cannot get over how much moaning and whinging people on HN do about supposedly not being able to choose their search-engine on iOS "without jail-breaking" their device when simply switching to another browser like iCab Mobile means they can choose absolutely any search engine they want in addition to the 25 that are included by default . For goodness sake do the minimum amount of research before squealing helplessl…

Defaults matter, and defaults encode the behavioral choices of like 80% of users. The downstream effects of this are that the default options have the most support. Its totally rational to complain about a bad default option.

80%? I think it's over 99%. Very few people would install a custom browser on mobile, most go with the default.
Post reply on HN