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Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

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Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#191

Post by goodluckchuck »

adam_arthur wrote: post #184
roody15 wrote: post #182

I have always found it problematic that on mobile safari you cannot change search providers. They have a small list to choose from (bing, yahoo, duckduckgo, google). but no way to add anything else. You have to jailbreak the device just to add a different search provider. This seems anticompetitive IMO.

That way they can charge you to get on the list! China has screwed up a lot with the messaging behind their regulations on tech companies, but the spirit of promoting competition from them was good. Competitive markets are more important than free markets for positive societal outcomes.

No post body was provided.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#192

Post by sovnade »

redanddead wrote: post #187
throwoutway wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China has screwed up a lot with the messaging behind their regulations on tech companies, but the spirit of promoting competition from them was good. You have got to be joking..

Explain your POV

Are we really talking about China promoting competition in the context of search results?

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#194

Post by jrochkind1 »

CobrastanJorji wrote: post #36

Here's the complaint: https://www.docketalarm.com/cases/California_Northern_Distri... The putative class they're suing to represent is apparently "All consumers and businesses who paid Google to place advertising on Google search in the United States since January 1, 2005." I think the basic argument is "Apple might have created a competing search engine business, but Google paid them not to, which hurt people buying…

US antitrust law right now basically operates on the principle that the only time anything is illegal is if it hurts consumer prices.

So that probably explains the convoluted cause of action, in that the only legal way to challenge it is probably with a weird convoluted cause of action like that, because it has to come back to consumer prices somehow to have a chance in court.

Google (or anyone) can have a monopoly and engage in anticompetitive practices, it's only illegal if you can show it hurt consumer prices.

The law didn't always work that way and doesn't need to, but that's more or less how it is now.

https://www.pbwt.com/antitrust-update-blog/congress-hears-ch...

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#195

Post by adam_arthur »

sovnade wrote: post #192
redanddead wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Explain your POV

Are we really talking about China promoting competition in the context of search results?

This is an article about allegations of anti-competitive behavior, and China has just spent a year enacting many new rules to foster competition among their tech companies.

In many areas they went too far, and their approach to enacting the rules led to mass, unnecessary fear, but the spirit behind a lot of the changes was good. e.g. Alibaba can't ban links to competitors within their social apps.

Apple does not allow use of custom search engines, unless you pay to get on their list, or consumer has to go through hoops with extensions.

Do I need to draw more lines to make the dots connect for you?

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#196

Post by fortran77 »

The "Alioto Law Firm" who wrote this press release can't spell the word "its."

This makes me wonder about the whole firm.

> "The complaint claims that the means used to effectuate the non-compete agreement included; (1) Google would share it's search profits with Apple;"

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#197

Post by stickfigure »

onion2k wrote: post #107
ahtihn wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that different to what they're doing with browsers? Last time I checked, you can't ship your own browser/js engine on iOS

It's exactly the same. I have no idea how they're able to get away with it.

Perhaps your understanding of antitrust law is flawed.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#198

Post by jpadkins »

judge2020 wrote: post #170
Bombthecat wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most other search engines use Google under the hut anyway.. I'm wondering sind quite a whole, when Google will block them..

Only Startpage uses Google, to my knowledge, as there isn’t an API you can enable to start getting Google’s search results (without entering into talks with their sales / exec team). Bing does, though, and that’s why Brave and DuckDuckGo use Bing under the hood a lot.

https://programmablesearchengine.google.com/about/ That product includes an option to search the web. For example, kiddle.co uses it to provide some of their web search results.

Also, many other search engines uses Google's search API. But as you said, that requires direct relationship with Google sales.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#199

Post by null_object »

I cannot get over how much moaning and whinging people on HN do about supposedly not being able to choose their search-engine on iOS "without jail-breaking" their device when simply switching to another browser like iCab Mobile means they can choose absolutely any search engine they want in addition to the 25 that are included by default.

For goodness sake do the minimum amount of research before squealing helplessly about needing to jailbreak your device.

Re: Lawsuit filed alleging Google is paying Apple to stay out of the search business

#200

Post by redanddead »

adam_arthur wrote: post #195
sovnade wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are we really talking about China promoting competition in the context of search results?

This is an article about allegations of anti-competitive behavior, and China has just spent a year enacting many new rules to foster competition among their tech companies. In many areas they went too far, and their approach to enacting the rules led to mass, unnecessary fear, but the spirit behind a lot of the changes was good. e.g. Alibaba can't ban links to competitors within their social apps. Apple does not allo…

I know nobody asked me, but personally I think your POV is right. I was listening to this podcast the other day about just this and the impression I got was "Wow, this may be good for the average Chinese person", I'm talking exclusively about the drive to enhance protections for citizens.

https://podtail.com/podcast/caixin-global-podcasts/china-sto...

It's narrated by an Asian-American guy, the article is written by a Chinese guy called Ren Yi.

I only learned a few things about China, so I'm uneducated on the matter, but I think we underestimate how massive their rural population is, and how huge the rift is between the rich and poor, but like I said, I'm uneducated on the matter.

I think it's not a bad thing if China adopts EU style protections from big companies for citizens. I don't see the problem with that. If I understood correctly, the avg CN citizen is racked with debt, schools are borderline torturous, can barely afford a home, a lot of the water is leaded, the land is contaminated, mothers can't trust the domestic baby formula or anything really, huge sexism issue for women, rape is common, theft is common, scams are everywhere and a million other issues, it reminds you of the avg US citizen and their million other issues. Imagine if the avg CN citizen ends up living a healthier life than the avg US citizen, despite the huge head-start, now that would be really sad, because it would shine a light on how stagnant life is for the avg US person.

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