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Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

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Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#181

Post by rm_-rf_slash »

JonathanBuchh wrote: post #30

It would be amazing if there was something that would convert recipes to the format used on Cooking For Engineers. It’s so intuitive and easy to read. I never want to look at steps to make a recipe again. Scroll to the bottom to see what I’m talking about: http://www.cookingforengineers.com/recipe/108/Banana-Nut-Bre...

Still a lot of text to get up and go, even if the context can be helpful.

Personally I am a fan of the Food Network recipes online, especially Alton Brown’s. Straight to the point with no fluff, and maybe a Good Eats segment if you’re lucky.

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#182

Post by pfranz »

Rygian wrote: post #18
2bitencryption wrote: post #11

What is the reason that every single recipe site, without fail, follows this same horrible pattern? I.e. the twenty paragraph "When I was a child growing up in Atlanta..." followed by a crappy in-house video player followed by, finally, the actual recipe? My assumption is SEO? For some reason, Google must really like having tons of text on your page, and dislikes simple "here's the recipe"? etc? Second question - any…

The copyright around the recipe itself is a challenging issue [1], so a simple way of guaranteeing that the site is not scrapped and published elsewhere verbatim is to include also non-recipe material that falls more clearly under copyright law. [1] https://www.copyrightlaws.com/copyright-protection-recipes/

I always see this as a stated reason, but I'm skeptical unless it's cargo-culting like "no copyright intended" on YouTube videos (but this is a lot more work). I can't see Adam and Joanne [1] or Holly [2] suing for copyright because when someone stole their Frito Pie recipe and left off the story at top. Especially, when they both have Google-defined tags to grab only the recipe and ingredients. As others have mentioned, the bigger sites (Allrecipes, food network, NYTimes, binging with babish etc.) tend not do the story thing.

Do you have any other info on copyright as a reason?

[1] https://www.inspiredtaste.net/15938/easy-and-smooth-hummus-r...

[2] https://www.spendwithpennies.com/easy-homemade-lasagna/

[3] https://developers.google.com/search/docs/advanced/structure...

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#183

Post by otrahuevada »

According to https://copyrightalliance.org/are-recipes-cookbooks-protecte...:

    Recipes can be protected under copyright law if they are accompanied by “substantial literary expression.” This expression can be an explanation or detailed directions, which is likely why food and recipe bloggers often share stories and personal anecdotes alongside a recipe’s ingredients.
So besides SEO, there's this thing where the recipe itself is basically defenseless against someone stealing it and calling it theirs but the sum of the fluff around it plus the recipe on the other hand can be copyrighted and enjoys all the protections afforded to these kinds of things. So, if say, Jamie Oliver likes your recipe and puts it in a book passing it as his, you can now legally tell him to stop doing that because of said fluff.

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#184

Post by kixiQu »

renewiltord wrote: post #164
pessimizer wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's weird how you go from "to me" to "wants us." Surely you can imagine that people might be interested in history and stories around food. I personally don't give a shit about mathematicians and scientists personal lives, but I don't have a problem imagining those who do. I think the numbers say it all. Others think that the examination of every detail of the person who wrote the numbers first might give them some…

In my experience, traditional English usage there would use context to replace "us" with "those of us like me". But since clearly that is not the case, I have replaced it so it is no longer 'weird' to you. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that if you polled recipe searchers, the vast majority (>66%) would say that they don't want the story. In fact, I'll back that. If you're in San Francisco, I will bet $1000 ag…

Bloggers who are putting care into their work typically write more for the people who follow them than for the randos who drop in from a Google search. What do people who subscribe to foodie Patreons care about? The people who have a list of bookmarked recipe blogs? What about people coming from Instagram posts who are drawn in by a beautiful photo, what are they hoping to see? Why are we establishing a framing that the people who should be most catered to are the people who care the least about the cook and their work?

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#185

Post by bluGill »

lkxijlewlf wrote: post #159
2bitencryption wrote: post #11

What is the reason that every single recipe site, without fail, follows this same horrible pattern? I.e. the twenty paragraph "When I was a child growing up in Atlanta..." followed by a crappy in-house video player followed by, finally, the actual recipe? My assumption is SEO? For some reason, Google must really like having tons of text on your page, and dislikes simple "here's the recipe"? etc? Second question - any…

Ratings for recipes never make sense anyway because if one reads the reviews they're always of the sort, "I LOVE THIS RECIPE! I used buttermilk instead of Milk, doubled the sugar, used almond extract instead of vanilla. This recipe is AMAZING!"

Those reviews are more useful that the recipes. If I am missing one ingredient I have more confidence in trying a substitute if someone else has before me (I've messed a few recipes up with a bad substitute). sometimes I'll look at the substitution and think that sounds better even though I have everything for the original (if I've made this before I'm more likely to do this for variety).

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#186

Post by troyvit »

I have to admit that recipes are valuable enough to me that I'm OK with the crap at the top. It's annoying, but it's an endearing kind of annoyance. The way I see it, they're providing a service and if they want to do it in this stupid way I'll go along with it, especially since the content isn't exactly horrible, it's just silly and inane and somehow adds to the whole cooking experience.

Sometimes the stuff I'm cooking actually turns out differently because of all the mad scrolling I do trying to find the next ingredient to add while my sauce pan is boiling over or whatever. Kindof fun.

Last, recipe books are a great way to get around this crap, and then you're actually paying for the knowledge you use.

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#187

Post by jeffbee »

js2 wrote: post #100

The comments on recipe sites are often useful. Things like: pre-heat your mason jars before pouring in the caramelized sugar or they'll crack. You can find clarifications, or things people have substituted, or just how a recipe has failed for some folks. There's a handful of recipe sites I tend to stick to. Smitten Kitchen, All Recipes, Serious Eats, NYT Cooking. I also have a few favorite cooking books: On Food and…

I agree the comments are often important. I also agree with your list of sources, and would add that the magazine Cook's Illustrated is nice.

I think the reason that people are all upset about the spammy recipe sites is they are too cheap to pay anything for content, so they are stuck with the spammers. The easy solution is to just look at yourself and stop being such a cheapskate. Buy a recipe book. Buy a magazine. Subscribe to a newspaper.

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#188

Post by bluGill »

2bitencryption wrote: post #11

What is the reason that every single recipe site, without fail, follows this same horrible pattern? I.e. the twenty paragraph "When I was a child growing up in Atlanta..." followed by a crappy in-house video player followed by, finally, the actual recipe? My assumption is SEO? For some reason, Google must really like having tons of text on your page, and dislikes simple "here's the recipe"? etc? Second question - any…

I've learned to only click on allrecipes.com all the others make it too hard to find the recipe I'm looking for. Please join me in rewarding the one good site that works. (note, the parent company was bought out this summer, the new owners may screw things up, if so punish them like all the others where you can't find the recipe)

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#189

Post by pfranz »

mongol wrote: post #167

My problem with recipes are - how do I know they are good? What is the quality control? Perhaps someone just grabbed a computer and wrote a bunch of steps down.

Honestly, I tend to rely on the "brand" of where I'm getting the recipe. Ratings are only useful if you trust the site to have good ratings (either an active audience with similar taste or editors filtering and publishing with similar taste). I haven't seen it much, but I also worry about food safety for random recipes.

Re: Show HN: OnlyRecipe.app – Remove clutter from recipe sites

#190

Post by mtm7 »

> What is the reason that every single recipe site, without fail, follows this same horrible pattern? I.e. the twenty paragraph "When I was a child growing up in Atlanta..." followed by a crappy in-house video player followed by, finally, the actual recipe?

I lived with a food blogger for six years and might be able to provide some more perspective for these types of comments (beyond just SEO).

First, there's actually an audience that _is_ interested in this type of content. Some are repeat readers who want to follow food bloggers' lives, similar to how HN readers might follow a streamer on Twitch. It's a much more rewarding journey if people don't just see you as a recipe database and bounce, but actually engage with you and follow you over time.

Second, a lot of food bloggers simply enjoy writing and see their blogs as a way to express themselves. Some of them write these stories for their family and friends and didn't think they'd be at the top of Google.

Third, it takes a ton of effort to write a single recipe. I can't speak for others, but hers involved multiple days of planning/cooking/shooting, remaking it several times so she knew it'd be consistent for the reader, planning/shooting/editing the photos, and even scrapping recipes altogether if they didn't work out. She also had to deal with the business end of things (like getting a lawyer, accountant, social media manager, and managing contracts with sponsors). Her attitude was basically, "if I'm doing all of these things to provide someone with a free recipe, they can scroll past my story if they don't feel like reading it". (That being said, her site was pretty minimalist compared to other food blogs – she didn't run ads.)

FWIW, I don't have a problem with onlyrecipe.app, I just wanted to share this because I'd be interested if I didn't know already.

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