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Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

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Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#331

Post by rrrrrrrrrrrryan »

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

For anyone who wants to read more about this hobby: https://outline.com/TCdngY

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#332

Post by lotsofpulp »

paxys wrote: post #217
lotsofpulp wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Very little is known of Mr. Balwani, including why he is called “Sunny.” This might be because Saturday in Hindi and other Indian languages is “sunny-var”, and the day of the week you are born on is a common nickname, in conjunction with “sunny” being an easy to pronounce and common English word.

"Sunny" is a common nickname in India but it has nothing to do with the day you were born on.

Oh, maybe I interpreted wrong. I do know that was the explanation given to me from a friend I have nicknamed Sunny.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#333

Post by bern4444 »

neom wrote: post #314
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What Elizabeth did wasn't far from what many many many founders do. Hard disagree on that one. It's certainly not common nor acceptable to knowingly lie to investors like Holmes did. There is nothing normal or common about the type of fraud that Holmes perpetuated, despite attempts to downplay or normalize it. > I'm sure it's going to be an unpopular opinion but personally if this is the new standard, the SEC shoul…

Of course I can name multiple, I've been involved in hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars in startups deals, I've spent over 15 years in the industry...

Are you willing or can you share the names of some of these companies?

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#334

Post by vicda »

niyazpk wrote: post #272
beebmam wrote: post #227

Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society. One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. My 80 year old mother was recently tricked into wiring money by Indian sc…

> Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society Really?! Interesting... I agree, a functioning society needs good law and order, and some way to prosecute and bring criminals to justice. But I am personally not convinced that sending someone "to jail for a long, long time" is the solution. How is that productive? I think we need to come up with better ways to serv…

Trying to abolishing imperfect parts of society with no tested replacement solution is a dangerous game.

Some people are or became irredeemably antisocial and need to be kept away from society at large. Watch any liveleak video around the mexican cartel if you need a reminder of what evils people are truly capable of.

That being said, sure want to properly reintegrate everyone possible. But society understandably does not exactly welcome past offenders back with welcome arms. It is kind of hard to be productive again when few places will even consider hiring you. That isn't a stigma you can just wish away.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#335

Post by shoulderfake »

user_7832 wrote: post #260
beebmam wrote: post #227

Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society. One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. My 80 year old mother was recently tricked into wiring money by Indian sc…

> One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. I'm really not sure fraud is the biggest issue plaguing these countries... corruption is definitely an issue (though the US has in some cases legalized it into lobbying and…

How many wall st honchos went to jail for the subprime mortgage crash ?

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#336

Post by beebmam »

niyazpk wrote: post #272
beebmam wrote: post #227

Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society. One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. My 80 year old mother was recently tricked into wiring money by Indian sc…

> Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society Really?! Interesting... I agree, a functioning society needs good law and order, and some way to prosecute and bring criminals to justice. But I am personally not convinced that sending someone "to jail for a long, long time" is the solution. How is that productive? I think we need to come up with better ways to serv…

The point of sending them to jail for a long, long time is to protect society from them. Honest people don't deserve to live in a society filled with liars and cheats and conmen. Send them straight to hell

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#337

Post by hnacct2001 »

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

thanks for sharing -- most entertaining thread i've read in quite some time

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#338

Post by manquer »

kstrauser wrote: post #210
neom wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I followed the case very closely, read the transcripts I could find daily etc. What Elizabeth did wasn't far from what many many many founders do. This was held to a legal standard, sure, but let's be real here... since when was the legal standard the SV standard? Is SV really the bastion of morality and legal ethics? Is that the new norm, good behaviour? Notably some investors refused to participate and iirc Draper…

> people are having success with her ideas today Citation needed. The whole concept has a critical flaw, as pointed out by her engineering staff and medical advisors: blood tests require a certain minimum volume of blood to work, and that's inescapable because blood components are discrete, not continuous. For example, a drop of blood is about .05mL, or about 1/20th of a milliliter. A common testing sample size in a…

While Theranos claims were absurd , it is not hard to believe there is scope for improvements in specific areas which is what OP is trying to say I guess.

1. The premise assumes there are not significant wastage in the current processes and those are near optimal. Any non optimal paths could potentially benefit from improvements

2. While there are some tests at that low concentrations not all tests have components at that low concentrations. Those could certainly be improved ?

3. Reuse and cross testing the same samples, or testing for multiple things at the same time etc, are all areas that could yield better outcomes than current standard.

4. Perhaps it is also possible that while primary marker for a test is not present in the sample, its presence in the blood could have left other markers that are detectable

I don't know anything about lab testing, if I can think of few approaches to solution for the low sample problem. Experts may have many other approaches so it shouldn't be surprising if there are improvements claimed ?

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#339

Post by flunhat »

niyazpk wrote: post #272
beebmam wrote: post #227

Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society. One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. My 80 year old mother was recently tricked into wiring money by Indian sc…

> Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society Really?! Interesting... I agree, a functioning society needs good law and order, and some way to prosecute and bring criminals to justice. But I am personally not convinced that sending someone "to jail for a long, long time" is the solution. How is that productive? I think we need to come up with better ways to serv…

> But I am personally not convinced that sending someone "to jail for a long, long time" is the solution. How is that productive?

At least for murder, one of the strongest predictors of whether a person will kill is if they've killed before. So prison is productive because it makes it more difficult (though not impossible) for a person to keep killing.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#340

Post by mdoms »

metadat wrote: post #250
testplzignore wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on a very quick reading, I think the most serious offense (the $100M one) would at least land in the 97-121 months bucket. If she serves half of that, best case for her is 4 years. Not too bad.

Hopefully she'll get more, SV could use a good example. Otherwise it signals that wantrepeneurs can keep doing it with minimal repercussions.

Ok I'm not American so perhaps my perspective is different... More than 10 years would be utterly barbaric. The 65 years mentioned in another comment chain would be well beyond the pale.

I'm no fan of Holmes, but what good does it serve to lock up non violent criminals for decades?

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