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Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

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Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#311

Post by adflux »

landemva wrote: post #289
adflux wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My utopian hope for the future is that we start sending rigs in orbit close to the sun ... Thats your utopia? How about we figure out a way to store/transfer wealth which doesnt need to perform arbitrary calculations and cause massive power consumption

We have tried the other way of enforcing money. That route of using military force is well understood. Is it better?

You think crypto will make the military unnecessary? Let's see how good you are at protecting your wallet keys with a gun to your head...

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#312

Post by hagbard_c »

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #225
alkonaut wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you want that? There isn’t a cheaper centralized system of rendering 3D graphics that uses 1/1000 the energy. We can handle transactions with quite little energy using traditional means. It’s not pseudonymous or decentralized and it’s not extremely efficient. But compared to Bitcoin it’s a wonder of efficiency. I wouldn’t take anything off the table when it comes to banning energy use. But rendering in part…

Ok, imagine yourself in Belarus. All traditional means are under government control. How do you fund anti-Lukashemko guerrillas? Cash?

Not using any currency which depends on an internet connection anyway since that makes it rather easy for the government to deprive those rebels of their funding - just block the 'net and jam satellite-borne access methods. I'd fund my guerillas with armaments, food and medical supplies. Gold and silver maybe. No digital currencies for the stated reasons.

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#313

Post by scottiebarnes »

arcticbull wrote: post #183
scottiebarnes wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a waste to you, but not to the people who use and value it.

I mean, ok, you could make that argument about literally anything. It's a tautology. Thing has value to people who value it because people value it. Neat. It's intrinsic value is zero. It's economic value is negative, because it's a Ponzi scheme. [1] [1] https://ic.unicamp.br/~stolfi/bitcoin/2020-12-31-bitcoin-pon...

What does that make central banking and fiat?

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#314

Post by [deleted] »

landemva wrote: post #289
adflux wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My utopian hope for the future is that we start sending rigs in orbit close to the sun ... Thats your utopia? How about we figure out a way to store/transfer wealth which doesnt need to perform arbitrary calculations and cause massive power consumption

We have tried the other way of enforcing money. That route of using military force is well understood. Is it better?

[deleted]

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#315

Post by missedthecue »

andrepd wrote: post #26
grzm wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gold as a material has many uses, not only to back currency. Comparison to bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies is not particularly useful.

Over half of gold mined goes to investment purposes: https://www.statista.com/statistics/299609/gold-demand-by-in...

What percentage of Bitcoin is used for speculation/investment

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#317

Post by arcticbull »

scottiebarnes wrote: post #313
arcticbull wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, ok, you could make that argument about literally anything. It's a tautology. Thing has value to people who value it because people value it. Neat. It's intrinsic value is zero. It's economic value is negative, because it's a Ponzi scheme. [1] [1] https://ic.unicamp.br/~stolfi/bitcoin/2020-12-31-bitcoin-pon...

What does that make central banking and fiat?

Money.

All money that enters into circulation via fractional reserve lending is backed by demand for that same money, and enforced by the legal system. The repayment of the issuing loan. That’s where it’s value comes from.

Unlike bitcoin fiat operates on a pull model - demand driven. It doesn’t start by creating supply and having people shill it.

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#318

Post by timeon »

tor12 wrote: post #238
cipheredStones wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Generally, if your system can handle the vast majority of cases easily and most edge cases with some effort, you don't think about tearing it down to replace it with an entirely new one that's far less efficient and far more difficult for the end user. The appeal of cryptocurrencies for most buyers is that Bitcoin dectupled in a year and people seem to be getting fabulously rich off of them everywhere you look. No mo…

its more efficient and more useful than anything else currently available

> more useful than anything else

134 TWh in a year and you can`t even use this currency in the grocery store.

> more efficient than anything else

PoW is inefficient by design.

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#319

Post by cuteboy19 »

landemva wrote: post #292
dghlsakjg wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question: how would cryptocurrencies and defi have helped avoid/mitigate the subprime lending crisis specifically?

If you do want to learn how this works with defi, look at DAI and those loans which are based on overcollateralization and incentives for people to hunt for and liquidate others who don't have enough collateralization. 2008 was caused by starting with undercollateralized loans enabled in part by fake rating agency ratings, and failure of regulators to regulate. That system failed and the backstop FDIC can only write…

The stablecoin tether is a great example of how cryptocurrencies do not solve this problem. Tether claims to have a 1:1 dollar backing for its token and yet investigation after investigation found absolutely nothing backing their coins. Tether is the most popular stablecoin out there and has a "market cap" of 78 billion [0]. This proves that whatever issues the current banking system has, cryptocurrency has them much worse.

[0] https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/tether/

Re: Bitcoin consumed 134 TWh in total during 2021

#320

Post by paulryanrogers »

sgjohnson wrote: post #310
la_fayette wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are no new dirty power plants like coal or nuclear built specifically for bitcoin mining. There are definitely new renewable energy sources built for bitcoin mining. So dirty energy would be used anyway! The rate of new renewable energy sources created because of bitcoin is higher overall than without bitcoin.

>like coal or nuclear Nuclear is dirty? How?

Nuclear fuel is made by physically mining the elements that go into it then processing them in an energy intensive process.
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