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Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

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Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#511

Post by mbreese »

macintux wrote: post #461
ddalex wrote: post #452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why do you say that? sounds like he was braked-checked by the tesla of course, in a large sense, the one that hits from behind is at fault, but brake-checking is problematic

Problematic and completely unexpected. No one speeding past you is going to brake check you for moving into their lane, so this kind of behavior from a computer is inevitably going to lead to accidents.

You can’t know what is in front of the other car or why the Tesla braked. It could have been passing a slower car or truck (likely given the situation as described). If that car swerved a bit into the Tesla’s lane, braking could have been the right choice.

The car behind is always responsible for maintaining distance.

Realistically, if the tesla felt squeezed by a car it was passing, going a bit onto the shoulder would have been what I would have expected from a human driver. But no auto steering, tesla or otherwise, is going to do that.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#512

Post by ricardobayes »

bradleyjg wrote: post #460
ricardobayes wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After working in the industry, I can safely say self-driving is a massively profitable lie. It can work in limited instances, but I don't think we'll have full self driving aka level 5 in urban environments until infrastructure changes. You simply need 5G/V2X for that. Just relying on cameras will not work. On that page, I have my concerns about EVs in general, who knows what the long-term health effects are for sitt…

> Just relying on cameras will not work. If it’s good enough for us (two small cameras and two microphones all mounted right next to each other) why is it inherently infeasible for a computer?

I find that argument being thrown around once in a while, but let me ask you this. Why are we spending billions of dollars in research that we can vaguely hope to reach human perception levels in one distant day. This whole thing is just not worth it. That's why I said especially for dense urban traffic driving, we need extra sensing, and need from the environment so it can help the car. Imagine if the car knew there is nothing coming from a junction we don't need to stop all the way etc.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#513

Post by ricardobayes »

eatbitseveryday wrote: post #484
quartesixte wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d be less worried about long term effects and more worried about the fact that lithium-ion is very flammable. It’s bad enough that airlines ban lithium of quantities no more than a single smartphone from entering the cargo bay of a passenger airliner. And then you have an entire car’s worth just strapped to the bottom of your chassis.

> more worried about the fact that lithium-ion is very flammable As is standard fuel used in combustion engines (which you know) so how does the argument of flammability hold stronger here? Ford Pinto blew up due to tank puncture during an accident.

I'd argue those issues are very well researched and material science fixed these.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#514

Post by ricardobayes »

rhn_mk1 wrote: post #427
ricardobayes wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All I'm saying is there's a possibility of discovering the power electronics affecting us in an adverse way. Similarly how we thought lead, asbesthos, radium were harmless at first.

Lead is a bad example, unless you mean long forgotten times. Even Romans knew: > The Romans were aware that lead could cause serious health problems https://archive.epa.gov/epa/aboutepa/lead-poisoning-historic... Asbestos, likewise, was being used 80 years after the discovery of ill effects: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_asbestos_disease_medic... Radium's danger was known 2 years after its discovery according…

Yeah but we happily painted our walls with it even just 20 years ago.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#515

Post by ricardobayes »

kortex wrote: post #495
eatbitseveryday wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> more worried about the fact that lithium-ion is very flammable As is standard fuel used in combustion engines (which you know) so how does the argument of flammability hold stronger here? Ford Pinto blew up due to tank puncture during an accident.

Metal fires (class D) are much harder to fight than petroleum fires (class B). They can burn way hotter, reignite after seemingly going out, and of course react to water to produce hydrogen. Current fire fighter directives for putting out BEVs is either dump a loader bucket of sand on it (which most don't have yet), or drag it some place safe and let it burn out. Also gasoline just sits there until ignited. Lithium b…

I'm also very pro EV. Working in self-driving and hybrids/EVs driving around in prototype vehicles I often found the on-board GPS jammed. I just found it unnerving to drive around in a vehicle emitting such strong EMF even on-board devices go haywire. That made me think.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#516

Post by quartesixte »

eatbitseveryday wrote: post #484
quartesixte wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d be less worried about long term effects and more worried about the fact that lithium-ion is very flammable. It’s bad enough that airlines ban lithium of quantities no more than a single smartphone from entering the cargo bay of a passenger airliner. And then you have an entire car’s worth just strapped to the bottom of your chassis.

> more worried about the fact that lithium-ion is very flammable As is standard fuel used in combustion engines (which you know) so how does the argument of flammability hold stronger here? Ford Pinto blew up due to tank puncture during an accident.

As the sibling post said, lithium fires are a completely different class and beast than a petroleum fire.

Material science improvements won’t overcome the fundamental fact that the third atomic element on the periodic table just really wants to light things on fire.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#517

Post by Diesel555 »

SkyMarshal wrote: post #49
onphonenow wrote: post #16

The memo from Emirates about not setting altitude in system to airport altitude is so weird. I really hope that's not the actual message Emirates is putting out there. It doesn't matter was in system. You run your checklists and configure for your own flight / your own departure etc. Memo should be to training / recruitment - where did you find these pilots to fly a 777? So they obviously didn't pre-flight the flight…

> It doesn't matter was in system. You run your checklists and configure for your own flight / your own departure etc. I am not a pilot, but that's exactly what I thought when I read the memo too. They should be putting responsibility for the next flight on the next flight's crew, not the prior flight's crew. Train each crew to assume the plane they're prepping for their next flight is FUBAR in every way, checklist e…

Some settings in airplanes are last left. And this is okay. If you had to reset every setting at all times it would cost time. Sometimes you find one that you go "man I wish that wasn't last left." Then software updates fix that.

> I am not a pilot, but that's exactly what I thought when I read the memo too. They should be putting responsibility for the next flight on the next flight's crew, not the prior flight's crew.

It's not a matter of responsibility, it's a risk mitigation measure. Adding the additional check is common in aviation. Yes, it is the next crew's responsibility, however if you can mitigate a risk by adding some procedure to what the previous crew does, at little or no cost until a software update is released fixing the issue, you do that every time.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#518

Post by quacked »

jrochkind1 wrote: post #299
azth wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - Has lower-level officials that accept bribes How many countries does that leave? And why only low level, why not also high level? Doesn't that rule out the US as well? > - Has had airlines and planes for fewer than 5 decades Also sounds arbitrary.

I'm gonna say 'Prioritizes "face" or "reputation" above literal accuracy' is definitely the US too.

I concur that there are places where this is true, but not at all to the level that it's true in Asian and African countries

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#519

Post by CamperBob2 »

ricardobayes wrote: post #416
PKop wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is exactly why the mass delusion propagated by Elon that Tesla's have full self driving is terrifying, and why "self driving" in general is a sinister lie that endangers the public.

After working in the industry, I can safely say self-driving is a massively profitable lie. It can work in limited instances, but I don't think we'll have full self driving aka level 5 in urban environments until infrastructure changes. You simply need 5G/V2X for that. Just relying on cameras will not work. On that page, I have my concerns about EVs in general, who knows what the long-term health effects are for sitt…

who knows what the long-term health effects are for sitting on top of a HV battery and being surrounded by that electro-smog.

A fellow named Planck knew, when he used the expression E=hv to describe the difference between ionizing and non-ionizing radiation. You just missed class that day, I imagine. Fortunately it's never too late to learn.

Re: Boeing 777 departing Dubai nearly had a major incident after takeoff

#520

Post by quacked »

throwaway898989 wrote: post #281
azth wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - Has lower-level officials that accept bribes How many countries does that leave? And why only low level, why not also high level? Doesn't that rule out the US as well? > - Has had airlines and planes for fewer than 5 decades Also sounds arbitrary.

I am expat in south east asia and his comment is correct low level officials taking bribes means you can do stuff like never wear a seatbelt, just pay the cop $20 USD if you get pulled over. get pulled up for smoking indoors? $20 USD. run over an illegal immigrant and kill them? USD 1000 to have their records completely erased. Sim card? $5 USD cash. rape? what? the police here hung up on my friend on a 911 call beca…

You said it better than I could. I am a US citizen, and most of my middle/upper-middle class colleagues simply cannot imagine that their society is the result of many hundreds of thousands of people following totally arbitrary rules, and that if people don't follow those rules their society will collapse. They think that US cops (who for the most part can't be bribed by citizens) are normal, and non-US cops who accept bribes are somehow exotic or abnormal.
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