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Web3 is centralized

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Re: Web3 is centralized

#131

Post by int_19h »

mattlondon wrote: post #64
chrisco255 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The existing internet is dominated by trillion dollar monopolies. How do you reconcile that Web3 is less democratic than a megacorp oligopoly than can unperson people at will? Web3 has decentralization, freedom of speech, anti-gatekeeping, permissionlessness and inclusiveness, at its core.

> Web3 has decentralization, freedom of speech, anti-gatekeeping, permissionlessness and inclusiveness, at its core. We already have all of that in the existing web infrastructure, and have had it since the very beginning. I can spin up a HTTP server on a raspberry pi running in my basement right now and anyone on the internet can access it for free and without any hinderence. With web3 there is gatekeeping and centr…

> and anyone on the internet can access it for free and without any hinderence.

Well, right up until their ISP blocks your website. Or the DNS root removes your record.

Re: Web3 is centralized

#132

Post by ur-whale »

rambambram wrote: post #104

I'm not for or against, I just find it strange that stuff that already has a name (like blockchain, crypto, etc.) somehow needs another name or some new kind of umbrella name. I'm not for or against, because it's unclear what there is to be for or against. Web3 is nothing but an echo chamber. A very empty echo chamber, so it echoes pretty nice. I'm back to the world wide web. I've been designing and programming for t…

> I just find it strange that stuff that already has a name

This is called marketing.

Entire industries depend on it or even simply exist because of it.

For a closer to home example, see Free Software (which scared businesses away because it had the word "free" in it) vs. Open Source (which made folks understand they could escape things like vendor lock-in)

Re: Web3 is centralized

#133

Post by cryptica »

root_axis wrote: post #121
darawk wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree completely. There is a ton to criticize about crypto and "Web3" (I hate the term, tbh). It's rife with scams and unearned wealth. Even the things that aren't outright scams are mostly people selling hype. But this technology does enable something novel. Digital self-custody of scarce assets is a new thing. A thing that nobody could do before this stuff. And if that has utility, then the infrastructure for tradi…

Over the years I've witnessed a lot of heated debates on HN... Is the JS ecosystem actually too complex? Is PHP really a fractal of bad design? Is learning vim worth the effort or is it all hype? Is golang fundamentally broken because it lacks(lacked) generics? Does anyone ever actually need k8s? Is nosql always the wrong choice? Is the linux desktop experience truly productive or should you just use a mac? Types or…

I suspect that big corporations and big investment firms are pumping a lot of money into the cryptocurrency space to prevent innovation and to encourage scams in order to discredit the space. They want to buy it up, hype it up, then dump their bags on mom-and-pop investors while attempting a controlled demolition of the space.

This might sound far-fetched to outsiders, but not so far-fetched to those who have worked inside the industry and seen the waste. I've seen obvious shitcoins repeatedly succeed while legitimate tokens never get any attention. In this industry, you can feel the unlimited currency coming straight off the money printers. It's just like Wall Street Bets in reverse except it's worth over a $ trillion and they're going after regular people instead of big hedge funds.

Re: Web3 is centralized

#134

Post by int_19h »

birracerveza wrote: post #89
kkjjkgjjgg wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Matrix would probably be a better choice by now?

Probably, but everyone has a Discord account, so if you want actual users you essentially have to use Discord (yay centralization).

It feels like switching from Discord to Matrix is an easier proposition than switching from whatever currency people are using to cryptocoins.

Re: Web3 is centralized

#135

Post by manojlds »

neuroma wrote: post #72

It's fascinating how on hacker news one typically finds detailed, reasoned and thoughtful comments. However on the topic of crypto and web3 the comments reliably degenerate into partisan tit for tat, consisting mainly of poorly researched, unreasoned sound bytes. It's a pity because I'd love to hear quality thought on the space. My personal view is that crypto and Web3 "are a thing" (Mean Girls) and will continue to…

And Vitalik has a good blog post on what kind of decentralisation we are talking of with crypto and blockchain.

He says blockchain is logically centralized, which is what this post here is essentially talking about.

https://medium.com/@VitalikButerin/the-meaning-of-decentrali...

Re: Web3 is centralized

#136

Post by ur-whale »

Findeton wrote: post #15
Anon1096 wrote: post #6

I think this is a pretty weak article regarding web3. The author wants to claim Ethereum or Bitcoin are more centralized than HTTP, but that isn't a valid comparison. Anyone can spin up their own blockchain exactly in the same fashion of spinning up their own webserver. It's more comparable to something like AWS or Discord or Twitter. Now, I would still say the majority of all things developed on the blockchain are v…

Also you can use BSV (Bitcoin Satoshi Vision) to store the whole images on-chain, literally for cents on the dollar. And yes, BSV also has smart contracts, just like the original Bitcoin did. 53% of all transactions happen in BSV, more than Bitcoin, Ethereum and XRP together: https://bitinfocharts.com/cryptocurrency-charts.html

You've somehow managed to bring up the probably unique topic (utter contempt for Craig Wright) that squarely unites crypto-lovers (because they know him to be the worst kind of scammer) and crypto-haters (who believe Wright to be canonically representative of the entire space).

That's quite a feat, but I somehow doubt you'll get upvoted much.

Re: Web3 is centralized

#137

Post by yosito »

I too, believe that while blockchain technology holds a lot of promise, it is not fulfilling the purpose of decentralization, due in large part to so many transparent cash grabs. The current crypto craze is nothing more than a fancy gold rush.

It will be interesting to see where blockchain technology ends up after the gold rush is over.

Re: Web3 is centralized

#138

Post by tehbeard »

darawk wrote: post #87
neuroma wrote: post #72

It's fascinating how on hacker news one typically finds detailed, reasoned and thoughtful comments. However on the topic of crypto and web3 the comments reliably degenerate into partisan tit for tat, consisting mainly of poorly researched, unreasoned sound bytes. It's a pity because I'd love to hear quality thought on the space. My personal view is that crypto and Web3 "are a thing" (Mean Girls) and will continue to…

Agree completely. There is a ton to criticize about crypto and "Web3" (I hate the term, tbh). It's rife with scams and unearned wealth. Even the things that aren't outright scams are mostly people selling hype. But this technology does enable something novel. Digital self-custody of scarce assets is a new thing. A thing that nobody could do before this stuff. And if that has utility, then the infrastructure for tradi…

> But this technology does enable something novel. Digital self-custody of scarce assets is a new thing.

... It gives you a receipt.

A digital receipt. That points to a URL that may or may not exist in 10 years?

Re: Web3 is centralized

#139

Post by elevader »

cryptica wrote: post #133
root_axis wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Over the years I've witnessed a lot of heated debates on HN... Is the JS ecosystem actually too complex? Is PHP really a fractal of bad design? Is learning vim worth the effort or is it all hype? Is golang fundamentally broken because it lacks(lacked) generics? Does anyone ever actually need k8s? Is nosql always the wrong choice? Is the linux desktop experience truly productive or should you just use a mac? Types or…

I suspect that big corporations and big investment firms are pumping a lot of money into the cryptocurrency space to prevent innovation and to encourage scams in order to discredit the space. They want to buy it up, hype it up, then dump their bags on mom-and-pop investors while attempting a controlled demolition of the space. This might sound far-fetched to outsiders, but not so far-fetched to those who have worked…

Honest question from a total outsider: What is the difference between a "shitcoin" and a "legitimate token"? And who gets to decide that?

Re: Web3 is centralized

#140

Post by rambambram »

ur-whale wrote: post #132
rambambram wrote: post #104

I'm not for or against, I just find it strange that stuff that already has a name (like blockchain, crypto, etc.) somehow needs another name or some new kind of umbrella name. I'm not for or against, because it's unclear what there is to be for or against. Web3 is nothing but an echo chamber. A very empty echo chamber, so it echoes pretty nice. I'm back to the world wide web. I've been designing and programming for t…

> I just find it strange that stuff that already has a name This is called marketing. Entire industries depend on it or even simply exist because of it. For a closer to home example, see Free Software (which scared businesses away because it had the word "free" in it) vs. Open Source (which made folks understand they could escape things like vendor lock-in)

No, it's not. With marketing it's more clear where the message is coming from. With marketing it's more clear what the message itself even is. This is way more sinister, it's wordplay on a bigger level. Maybe call it public relations.

Your examples miss my point. Your examples are clear enough and have an understandable meaning (once you know what it is). I stick with my comparison of 'the cloud' and 'web3', because they both were names before getting any significant meaning.

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