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Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

economist.com

351–360 of 448 posts

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#351
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does the US need to have traditional cities? I grew up in a high density city overseas and I can see the appeal of both types of city. I personally prefer low density, car centric cities (obviously we need to finish solving the emissions problem from cars, but that's separate).

We Americans are a nation of people who spend the vast majority of our waking hours inside. We go from building to building via car isolated from the world and each other. It’s an enormous waste of land and resources since every building has to have its own parking. Most parking lots at stores sit empty most of the time. It’s unhealthy that we walk so little. It’s unhealthy that we interact so little with those aroun…

The ability to walk in quiet, open spaces with low pollution is one of the top advantages of low density suburbia.

Low density suburbia can, and usually has, plenty of walking spaces with a ton of nature around. I lived in multiple suburban neighborhoods and I was always either within a short (and easy) drive to a park or had great walking areas in the neighborhood itself. Contrast with high density, where you have to deal with pollution, noise and potentially crime just to walk to a park (and in the park itself)

Regarding "fear or interacting", in my experience I have a lot of more interactions, of the cordial and polite kind, with the few neighbors I have in my low density area than I've ever had when I lived in a high density city where you can feel like an ant in a colony.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah this is because the USA has offloaded making all its stuff to China. With this in mind the USA CO2 number is even worse than it first appears.

Are you saying that emissions shouldn't be attributed to the country they're generated in? If so, that's certainly an interesting perspective.

The attribution is much more grey with the advent of so much globalization. As humans we like to pin the blame on a singular entity but the real world is far more complicated.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#353
post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This just historically inaccurate. Older US cities have many of the same characteristics as cities in other parts of the world. Those characteristics can vary, from small single-family homes tightly packed into a walkable neighborhood to large scale apartment dwelling with city squares and boulevards nearby. Americans used to build cities this way. Whether it was Moses or the emergence of a general dislike of each ot…

^ this is very accurate. There are multiple studies and historical accounts documenting exactly this TsunamiFury. Car lobbies are actually clearly tied to many city planning decisions, combined with white flight and corresponding government loans to create suburban communities that essentially cut others out. Additionally interstate commerce in a comparatively intensely large land mass like the US did create a need f…

Sure. I’ve studied that for years and I’ve come to the conclusion that is not the root cause. At the end of the day it’s a boogie man people trot out to excuse the fact that they did that and continue to do it together. They let it happen because they wanted it.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#354
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that Amsterdam made a conscious flip on this, as did other Dutch cities. Take your 4 lane street, turn one lane in a tram lane, one lane into grass + trees, reduce the width on the other two lanes and add a bike lane with a heightened divider. Bam you've got a street for a more livable city center.

It also took them the better part of several decades. Most cities that have tried doing this globally have only done so very recently, and it shows, but that's okay, because it took time and patience to methodically go through more or less every Dutch road and change it.

The US can't even imagine the collective attention span required to achieve this.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. If we liked each-other a bit more tho that force wouldn’t be there. I’ll quote the American classic “elbow room” as soft proof. https://youtu.be/aHVx4nqgMPQ

Wow, I had never seen that before. What a bizarre video with a forced tie-in of the whole manifest destiny idea with lunar missions (1976). It seems to completely ignore the reality of communities and society (and history, for that matter) for an unquestioning expansion of our domain, all wrapped up in this patronizing metaphor about needing "elbow room".

Yes. It is our narrative. This is one of the most honest videos I’ve ever found of our true views on life in America vs the ivory tower discussions that constantly blame GM and Robert Moses for destroying their “communities”

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I go to France or England or India (city centers and countryside) people may not Love each-other but they seem to generally be ok with being together and cooperating a bit more. In America it’s a whole new level. Except for a few idyllic small towns and suburbs that are actually economically and racially exclusionary that seem to have a faux-community.

Those quaint European neighborhoods, towns and villages are all also racially and culturally homogenous. And where that is changing, there is animosity and discord.

I agree even if people are downvoting you.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#357

Tokyo, and most big Japan cities, are probably the only cities I could visit regularly without getting bored. Whether it's cuisine, the shops, or the people, it felt like a home away from home. It's surely super crowded in some areas, but you don't have to go there either. There are plenty of areas where you could enjoy a quiet (literally) afternoon sipping a good coffee without having to queue up. Also, it's so damn…

That's the thing. It's a super great place when you are a tourist. I lived there and I saw the bad sides, too. To keep this amazing tidyness, order, extremely high quality of service, people go to their limits - with low pay and low perspectives. We have these "bad" jobs also here, people in those jobs are half-assing them, are rude or just quit. In Japan, at least from my experience, it's the conservative conformity…

Take a shot every time a Japan-fetishizing article is rocketing to the top of HN.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#358
post #26
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up in Stockholm and it too sadly is very, very car centric compared to Tokyo. Amsterdam, Barcelona, Copenhagen, Paris and others are much better... I wish all cities everywhere was more like them! (and Tokyo)

Note that Amsterdam made a conscious flip on this, as did other Dutch cities. Take your 4 lane street, turn one lane in a tram lane, one lane into grass + trees, reduce the width on the other two lanes and add a bike lane with a heightened divider. Bam you've got a street for a more livable city center.

It just keeps getting better! The next step is to eliminate car thoroughfare entirely, e.g. https://www.google.com/maps/place/Hortusbrug/@52.3673495,4.9... which as of a few years ago only has tram, bicycle, and pedestrian access.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like this is a chicken and egg problem. In many western cities - and I won't name names - the downtown area is not pleasant due to anti-social behaviour. So even when they do make it walkable, I don't want to walk there, I'd rather drive to a suburban mall and reduce my chances of an altercation. Until that's fixed it's a non-starter.

Is this a problem that America has generally? I.e there are areas where most people are scared to walk through in every city? I know many parts of the world have problems like this, but Europe doesn’t have many places like that.

> Is this a problem that America has generally? I.e there are areas where most people are scared to walk through in every city?

The problem is more that America has areas where most of the inhabitants are living in fear.

Re: Tokyo: A big city that is also pleasant to live in

#360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If we liked living together we wouldn’t be so car centric It's entirely the other way around, car centric planning results in less community. It's much easier to be angry at the other 2t metal boxes than at your fellow human being. American cities used to be just like European cities: designed for walking, mixed use developments, small shops, public transportation everywhere. It's only after the delusion of the car…

So this is not as black and white as it seems. There are three major pushes that end up pushing people out of the cities. * the aforementioned highway boom, but this is not enough to actually kickstart the whole thing; most European nations also had a highway boom around this time with much less sprawl * lending standards. Prior to the Great Depression, banks are wholly in control of mortgage lending. The collapse of…

Exactly. I said “don’t like” to avoid making this explicitly about racism but it’s true. And those planners that made these cities people currently complain about had droves of people who “didn’t want to be near other Americans of another color or class” and loved car filled suburbs and strip mall towns.
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