Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants • Hacker News Board

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#21

Post by Ekaros » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:14 PM UTC

outside1234 wrote: post #11

alexpetralia wrote: post #4

My extremely uninformed understanding is that there is an energy crisis in Europe, and that this will exacerbate the situation.

We should call this the "enable Putin" and "destroy the climate" plan. Honestly, I think we should declare a 50% tax on the gas going through the new Putin Nordstream 2 pipeline and direct the proceeds to NATO. Prices in externalities of gas usage and gets the EU closer to their NATO commitment.

Why waste money on military? Couldn't it be used much better ways like to decarbon various areas in infrastructure?

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#22

Post by oaiey » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

maxclark wrote: post #12

Nuclear power is an amazing energy source. It doesn’t look like we’ll ever get beyond the politics that would make small scale It’s really a shame.

It is amazing. But two major incidents within 30 years time range are not so amazing. When we continue in that rate we will have a serious problem. And with aging reactors and instability everywhere it does not look good.

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#23

Post by praptak » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

SimonSword91 wrote: post #7

I live in Germany and I wonder, what the consequences will be of shutting down both coal and nuclear in very short time. My guess is, we will pay for nuclear energy from France and coal energy from Poland when wind slows down. The new government tries to accelerate the construction of renewable energy but I think their plans will fail because of worker shortage and supply chain problems.

Shutting down nuclear to buy coal sounds pretty countereffective. What was the justification for this decision?

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#24

Post by cinntaile » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

maxclark wrote: post #12

Nuclear power is an amazing energy source. It doesn’t look like we’ll ever get beyond the politics that would make small scale It’s really a shame.

I doubt that politics is the reason why extremely small installations like that are uneconomical. The capex per kWh would be higher and the same for the opex, maybe you can properly reduce the capex if you produce tons of them but how will you fix the opex? You'll need too many people per kWh to operate the plant and for security.

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#25

Post by jpxw » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:16 PM UTC

oaiey wrote: post #22

maxclark wrote: post #12

Nuclear power is an amazing energy source. It doesn’t look like we’ll ever get beyond the politics that would make small scale It’s really a shame.

It is amazing. But two major incidents within 30 years time range are not so amazing. When we continue in that rate we will have a serious problem. And with aging reactors and instability everywhere it does not look good.

One incident caused by a natural disaster that would never happen in a European country like Germany, the other caused by mismanagement and frankly jaw droppingly pigheaded incompetence which would also never happen in a country like Germany.

Edit: in response to the large number of people bringing up BER and other infrastructure failures in Germany: yes, BER and others may have been bad, but a completely different kind (and magnitude) of incompetence than that which led to the Chernobyl meltdown. They really aren’t comparable.

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#26

Post by nvalis » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:17 PM UTC

For context a nice realtime overview of the current energy production in Germany is given by the Energy Charts[0] of the Frauenhofer ISE.

[0] https://energy-charts.info/charts/power/chart.htm?l=en&c=DE&...

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#27

Post by daenz » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:17 PM UTC

I have skimmed these kinds of articles, and maybe I am missing another important reason for this happening, but I am not seeing it. Is it essentially: people are scared of nuclear?

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#28

Post by csunbird » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:18 PM UTC

SimonSword91 wrote: post #7

I live in Germany and I wonder, what the consequences will be of shutting down both coal and nuclear in very short time. My guess is, we will pay for nuclear energy from France and coal energy from Poland when wind slows down. The new government tries to accelerate the construction of renewable energy but I think their plans will fail because of worker shortage and supply chain problems.

Yup, and we will end up paying 50% more for our energy usage, just because of political swings.

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#29

Post by RivieraKid » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:18 PM UTC

I'm sad that the UK has left the EU. Out of Germany, France and the UK, they always seemed like the voice of reason and the least bureaucratic. I can't exactly pinpoint why I think that but here are some examples - (1) they don't make ridiculous policy decisions such as shutting down nuclear power plants (ok, leaving the EU is an exception to this) (2) best at e-government (3) seems like a good environment for startups, for example almost all European fusion startups are from the UK (4) their politicians don't end up working for Russian energy companies.

Re: Germany shuts down half of its remaining nuclear plants

#30

Post by Ekaros » Fri, Dec 31, 2021, 7:18 PM UTC

mygoodaccount wrote: post #10

Why was Nord Stream 2's approval delayed by the German government?

Green points... Gas is not green, thus better not to progress it until absolutely mandatory. On other hand eco-terrorist are also against nuclear so better to get rid of that as well. And electricity comes from wall...