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Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

med.stanford.edu

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Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#121

Post by JamisonM »

andai wrote: post #111
ajaxexact wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you feel persistently low, tired, unhappy, or unable to do things then it's a real possibility. The PHQ-9 is a pretty standard depression screening questionnaire that you can complete in a minute or two. https://www.mdcalc.com/phq-9-patient-health-questionnaire-9

This doesn't control for the fact that the world sucks now, does it? I read a few months ago that ~25% of young adults had thoughts of suicide in the past year, so I think it's safe to say that the causes are more external than internal at this point.

Disentangling pandemic effects from "normal" life is complex but overall in the US suicide rates are actually down for 2020, though slightly increased for younger Americans. The trend in the US was upwards into 2019 so these are positive developments.

It is very difficult to properly assess 2020-2021 survey data both because the "you should be depressed" messaging is very strong in the media and the bias in who responds to surveys is complicated by the pandemic.

I am a Canadian and we saw an enormous drop in suicides, 30+%, in 2020 despite survey data (and wacky conspiracies) to the contrary.

I don't think it is "safe to say" much of anything about suicide rates or individual motivations, it is a complex issue.

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#122

Post by mysecretaccount »

serverlessmom wrote: post #108

Hey! I didn't under go SAINT TMS specifically, but I have undergone TMS therapy. Reading this article I'm not sure how different what I received actually is compared to SAINT, but TMS absolutely changed my life. I was referred to TMS after a rash of different medications and years of talk therapy fell short on relieving the worst of my symptoms. Many of the benefits the patients in this article discuss are ones I rec…

I have some questions if you don't mind:

Was it expensive?

Are there any downsides?

Do you think TMS is, like psychedelic therapy, potentially useful for people without depression (i.e. the "betterment of well people")?

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#123

Post by causi »

Cost (and availability/wait time for nations with public healthcare) are a concern. I know several people who received conventional TMS for 30 minutes a day for six weeks. That cost them, with insurance, about $1500. It was effective for an average of six months. This treatment is an order of magnitude more time spent in the machine, even if over a shorter period. What will it cost? Will it be accessible to those who need it?

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#124

Post by ActorNightly »

andai wrote: post #111
ajaxexact wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you feel persistently low, tired, unhappy, or unable to do things then it's a real possibility. The PHQ-9 is a pretty standard depression screening questionnaire that you can complete in a minute or two. https://www.mdcalc.com/phq-9-patient-health-questionnaire-9

This doesn't control for the fact that the world sucks now, does it? I read a few months ago that ~25% of young adults had thoughts of suicide in the past year, so I think it's safe to say that the causes are more external than internal at this point.

It's probably more likely that the internet is amplifying every problem in the world and since young adults grew up with it, it's more integral to their lives.

Additionally, there seems to be a stigma attached to not caring about a particular event, especially if doesn't affect you, all because of the slippery slope argument which is a fallacy.

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#125

Post by xapata »

rubicon33 wrote: post #117
pcurve wrote: post #57

“I don’t procrastinate anymore,” he added. “I’m sleeping better. I completely quit alcohol. I’m walking my dog and playing the guitar again, for nothing more than the sheer joy of it.” Most importantly, he said, “I’m remaining positive and being respectful of others. These are big changes in my life.” Serious question: are these typical signs of depression? Now I'm wondering if I have depression.

I've had depression for 20+ years and the best way I would describe it is like this: Think of that little "kick" you get when you think of something you want to do. Maybe you like eating ice cream, maybe you like playing tennis, whatever it is... that feeling, that subconscious little mental boost that gets you up off your ass, and moving... is completely absent in the depressed mind. That spark that initiates and su…

It took me a while to realize that most people don't consider suicide as one of a few strategies to deal with everyday problems. Thought process: I don't want to do my homework. I could (A) get up and do it, or (B) kill myself. Happily, I've learned to dissociate myself from the part of my consciousness that thinks that way.

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#126

Post by ck2 »

who the heck figured this treatment out because that is some incredible "debugging"

> They applied the stimulation in a subregion that has the strongest relationship with the subgenual cingulate, a part of the brain that is overactive in people experiencing depression. The transcranial magnetic stimulation strengthens the connection between the two regions, facilitating dorsolateral prefrontal cortex control of the activity in the subgenual cingulate.

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#127

Post by beginnercounter »

xapata wrote: post #125
rubicon33 wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had depression for 20+ years and the best way I would describe it is like this: Think of that little "kick" you get when you think of something you want to do. Maybe you like eating ice cream, maybe you like playing tennis, whatever it is... that feeling, that subconscious little mental boost that gets you up off your ass, and moving... is completely absent in the depressed mind. That spark that initiates and su…

It took me a while to realize that most people don't consider suicide as one of a few strategies to deal with everyday problems. Thought process: I don't want to do my homework. I could (A) get up and do it, or (B) kill myself. Happily, I've learned to dissociate myself from the part of my consciousness that thinks that way.

No post body was provided.

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#128

Post by d1lanka »

rubicon33 wrote: post #117
pcurve wrote: post #57

“I don’t procrastinate anymore,” he added. “I’m sleeping better. I completely quit alcohol. I’m walking my dog and playing the guitar again, for nothing more than the sheer joy of it.” Most importantly, he said, “I’m remaining positive and being respectful of others. These are big changes in my life.” Serious question: are these typical signs of depression? Now I'm wondering if I have depression.

I've had depression for 20+ years and the best way I would describe it is like this: Think of that little "kick" you get when you think of something you want to do. Maybe you like eating ice cream, maybe you like playing tennis, whatever it is... that feeling, that subconscious little mental boost that gets you up off your ass, and moving... is completely absent in the depressed mind. That spark that initiates and su…

"You asked me how depression felt, and this is all I could come up with. It feels like I’m walking upstream through a current strong enough to pull me under four times over.

There are others with me but they are walking along the banks telling me to “just get out of the water.”

But instead of extending a hand in help, they just move on and leave me behind.

Every once in a while I find a rock that is strong enough for me to lean on, And I can rest for a bit.

But the rocks always get tired of holding me up, and when they let go, I’m left drowning, thrown 50 feet back again.

And nothing is harder than standing up in that current when everything in you is telling you how much easier things would be if you just let yourself get dragged under."

—Unknown

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#129

Post by trts »

serverlessmom wrote: post #108

Hey! I didn't under go SAINT TMS specifically, but I have undergone TMS therapy. Reading this article I'm not sure how different what I received actually is compared to SAINT, but TMS absolutely changed my life. I was referred to TMS after a rash of different medications and years of talk therapy fell short on relieving the worst of my symptoms. Many of the benefits the patients in this article discuss are ones I rec…

Really happy to read about your positive experience. TMS changed my life also. It ushered me out of a nearly 5-year depression.

It was interesting to talk to the technicians/clinicians about how they came to be working at a TMS clinic. Several told me they'd been working in mental healthcare for decades, and were excited to work with TMS because it was the only thing they'd ever seen be truly effective in treating severe and persistent depression. One told me she had been helping patients through the 6 week program for three years and had not seen it fail to help a single person.

When I read the paper for this study it brought tears to my eyes. To think that it's possible to apply a lasting treatment to someone stuck in their own personal hell over the course of five days, and to have the effects persist for six months, is practically a miracle.

My treatment was over two years ago and I have not relapsed. There is hardly a day that passes where I do not feel deep gratitude for that burden to be lifted.

Re: Experimental depression treatment is nearly 80% effective in controlled study

#130

Post by astronautjones »

mysecretaccount wrote: post #122
serverlessmom wrote: post #108

Hey! I didn't under go SAINT TMS specifically, but I have undergone TMS therapy. Reading this article I'm not sure how different what I received actually is compared to SAINT, but TMS absolutely changed my life. I was referred to TMS after a rash of different medications and years of talk therapy fell short on relieving the worst of my symptoms. Many of the benefits the patients in this article discuss are ones I rec…

I have some questions if you don't mind: Was it expensive? Are there any downsides? Do you think TMS is, like psychedelic therapy, potentially useful for people without depression (i.e. the "betterment of well people")?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BKSWnuF3pA
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