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Why Web3?

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Re: Why Web3?

#11
post #6

This reads like an obligatory post on the topic with no real substance. I’m on mobile so it’s a good opportunity to succinctly express what I view as the major, near-future positives for Web3: - identity and trustless SSO via things like ENS and “sign in with {client such as metamask}” - data sovereignty, or at least less platform lock-in, especially for low/no code users - grants, crowdfunding, and other financial s…

The SSO thing has come up before. Trustless, decentralized, immutable databases are essentially the exact opposite of what you want in an SSO system; it's hard to think of an application where blockchain technology has less promise than SSO, which is about fine-grained policy control, out-of-band account recovery (the hardest problem in SSO), instantaneous revocation, and centralization of controls.

Re: Why Web3?

#12
What is the name of this cognitive bias that shows up in all web3 conversations about how internet/web2 ended up being a success and therefore web3 will too? If X led to Y, then Z that (we say) is similar to X will also lead to Y.

Re: Why Web3?

#13
The linked post[1], ironically, really helps to cement why I consider web3 to be interesting technologically but mostly nonsense from a product perspective.

> As a first approximation all the big powerful internet companies are really database providers. Facebook is a database of people’s profiles, their friend graphs and their status updates. Paypal is a database of people’s account balances. Amazon is a database of SKUs, payment credentials and purchase histories. Google is a database of web pages and query histories.

This is profoundly, naively, staggeringly wrong. The products that these companies provide to users[2] are not "the databases" - they are "the ability to do useful, meaningful, real-life impactful things". Facebook is not valuable as a service because of its database - it's valuable because I am able to interact with that database in ways that result in other people seeing the thing that I posted. PayPal is not useful to me because of those recorded balances - it is useful because merchants and financial institutions respect those balances are being equivalent to money. And so on - Amazon is useful because things actually show up at my door, Google is useful because it can use those links/queries to serve me the page that I was searching for.

This is, ironically, why many claims of web3's supremacy fall flat. As this[3] long-but-very-worthwhile rant about NFTs in gaming makes clear, simply claiming "ownership" is almost meaningless for anything other than simple financial transactions (which, I callously suspect, is 99% of what web3 is actually intended for anyway). If you want to say that you "own" a video game gun, that's all well-and-good - but to actually use it in a new game, that requires implementation effort from coders and artists, balancing, support, etc. In fact, the pleasant-sounding ideal of "own your digital assets anywhere!" is nonsense - it's meaningless to _own_ something if you can't actually _do_ anything with it. Ironically, it is actually _better_ for the customer to have their data/assets/what-have-you in a single database owned-and-operated by a single company - because then there is a reason for that company to continue to provide support for interactions _with_ that data.

Don't get me wrong - the commodification of customer data by Big Tech enrages and unsettles me, too, and I feel uncomfortable with the fact that we mostly rent internet services rather than owning them. But I've yet to see a convincing argument that Web3's notion of "ownership" actually results in anything tangible, anything other than bragging rights. If there's a way of effecting that ownership such that you can actually _do_ something with it (other than selling it), I'll be interested.

[1] https://continuations.com/post/671863718643105792/web3crypto...

[2] Obviously, those databases are valuable to advertizing, targeting, marketing, etc. companies, but I'm focusing on the customer experience here. You can't build up a valuable database if you cannot attract customers - and, anyway, isn't one of the whole points of web3 that customer data _isn't_ for sale? (A likely story...)

[3] https://t.co/0X0mMRFD2O

Re: Why Web3?

#14
The legitimacy of a worldwide database can be solved if the UN decides to run a MySQL instance, creates APIs for transactions between individuals, and agrees on a worldwide legal framework for transactions. In the eyes of many this would look more legitimate than the "network of terrorists and CP". I don't think that argument is enough

Re: Why Web3?

#15
why not sell an existing service as a new one by swapping the current database for a private centrally controlled blockchain? Think of all the cheddar.

Re: Why Web3?

#16
Let's say all crypto goes down in value 10% year after year in 2022 indefinitely.

This shouldn't necessarily affect the value or necessity (or lack thereof) of Web3. Can Web3 practically succeed under these conditions?

Unfortunately after engaging with many in person and on this forum, I've yet to hear a coherent strategy or purpose for Web3 that doesn't rely on centralized entities at any part of the chain, or rely on crypto going up.

Re: Why Web3?

#17
The crux of web3 is the UX, last mile, and/or listing problem: even if you, hypothetically, could find a decentralized solution for every centralized one, the last interface to this mechanism will be centralized.

Your UI (e.g. mobile app) is centralized so the best UI will eventually win because most end users care about UX or will enter this interface because they see a well paid ad. If this UI (e.g. a decentralized search engine interface) wants to censor some content then it will win over the decentralized protocol behind it.

Re: Why Web3?

#18
post #3

One thing that is confusing most loud supporters of Web3 are VCs and yet: "It all comes down to the database that sits behind an application. If that database is controlled by a single entity (think company, think big tech), then enormous market power accrues to the owner/administrator of that database. If, on the other hand, the database is an open public database that is not controlled and administered by a single…

Because experienced VCs know web 1.0 also started with decentralized / libertarian ideals, but ultimately early players built walled gardens and gatekeeping around the "world wide web".

They don't want to miss the web3 boat, and they're betting the web 1.0/web 2.0 playbooks still apply.

Re: Why Web3?

#19
post #3

One thing that is confusing most loud supporters of Web3 are VCs and yet: "It all comes down to the database that sits behind an application. If that database is controlled by a single entity (think company, think big tech), then enormous market power accrues to the owner/administrator of that database. If, on the other hand, the database is an open public database that is not controlled and administered by a single…

Wouldn’t an open database lead to loads of ACID issues or is the point of blockchain to prevent that

It’s a very limited database that is very slow and scales poorly.

Re: Why Web3?

#20

The author struggles to make the point that Web3 has value. Isn't "another opportunity for grift" a source of value for grifters?

Or even mention the “value” of the many DeFi apps that are available on the ethereum blockchain. What do they do?

My real question is: why would an investor want to put money into a company that doesn’t “own” the data from their customers? Do they even _have_ customers? What is their business model?

I know, I know - they make commissions on all those billions of transactions that will happen on the blockchain. Right? Is the value simply coming up with new ways to add cost to transactions?

I’m lost. Even when web2 was in an eyeballs race, I understood that you could monetize eyeballs with advertising (in what I considered a worst-case model). And SaaS was an obvious model, even if Marc Benioff seemed to yell about it a lot.

What is a web3 business model outside of currency exchange?

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