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“Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

paulbutler.org

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Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#51

Post by dvt »

Play-to-earn will die a painful death, but the takeaway here (which this article dodges) is that players should own their in-game assets. This is really where blockchain comes into play. Diablo 3 tried to do this, but they were too early and too greedy. If done correctly, owning your digital items is certainly more preferable than not.

Again, this is touched in half a paragraph, but this is the real revolutionary aspect of NFTs. And, paradoxically, it's nothing new: Steam store "items" are basically NFTs. Fortnite skins are basically NFTs. It's just that without a decentralized marketplace, you can't sell them.

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#52

Post by duskwuff »

nlh wrote: post #38

A thought exercise you should undertake if you're thinking about / talking about crypto/NFT/web3-related projects: If the financial instrument that underlies the project were to stop going up in value XX% per month, would you still be interested in the project? I do this a lot because I've made the conscious (and perhaps financially foolish) choice to stay away from everything crypto/blockchain related (for now, at l…

> Is there a there there without an underlying token that's gone up XX% in the last N months and everyone hopes will still go up XX% in the next N months?

Alternatively, even simpler: where is the money coming from? A bunch of people playing a game are a closed system, and no value is created by playing the game. If the only reason why players are earning money from this game is because more people are continually buying into the game and entering that system, that sounds more like a pyramid scheme than anything.

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#53

Post by wswope »

58x14 wrote: post #32

In the late 2000s, as a teenager, I was gifted a Runescape account. This account had level 80+ woodcutting, allowing one to chop magic trees - which would produce the most expensive lumber in the game. It took a staggering number of real hours to achieve this skill level, we're talking several hundred hours minimum. At some point I had realized that there were different sketchy websites that would buy and sell the in…

Similar to your story, I learned how to program by writing Runescape botting scripts.

Fast forward to today, and my hobby tech project for the past few months has been building a OSRS market-intel website for trading on the Grand Exchange. Great toy market that eliminates a lot of the complexity of “real-world” economics. Funny how outsized that damn game’s influence has been on the world.

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#54

Post by paulryanrogers »

advisedwang wrote: post #29
mherdeg wrote: post #18

Is this different from the phenomenon described at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_farming ? Honestly it seems like a pretty great career -- you get to spend your time indoors, probably somewhere climate controlled with electricity and restrooms. This is way better than the workhouse. Whoever is buying these things as a collector is basically donating their wealth to others, like a kind of privatized welfare. If p…

Except that we end up spending a vast amount of human effort doing work that fundamentally doesn't need to be done. There's no actual economic output to paying people to break rocks.

I guess it depends on the grind involved. Some streamers are paid to play games. They confess they don't always enjoy it or every game that people want to watch, but it seems better than some alternatives. And a few YouTubers I follow have admitted to less than stellar career prospects otherwise.

Now if it's pure, unfun grind that only pushes numbers around in an MMO then I'd agree it's basically just outsourced cheating. And a net negative both because it compromises a social form of entertainment and doesn't produce anything else of tangible value.

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#55

Post by pietrovismara »

beaconstudios wrote: post #30
seibelj wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What company is paying to do this?

I'll pay you to do it. I'll incorporate a company and then pay you through that if it feels more legit that way.

I'm more than willing to pay tickets to watch that guy dig a hole perpetually and learn what a bullshit job is. Let's do it.

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#56

Post by newaccount74 »

mherdeg wrote: post #18

Is this different from the phenomenon described at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_farming ? Honestly it seems like a pretty great career -- you get to spend your time indoors, probably somewhere climate controlled with electricity and restrooms. This is way better than the workhouse. Whoever is buying these things as a collector is basically donating their wealth to others, like a kind of privatized welfare. If p…

The article suggests that the game is currently only played by people hoping to make money. The money paid out to old players comes from new players.

It's just a Ponzi scheme.

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#57

Post by foxfluff »

999900000999 wrote: post #37
advisedwang wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that we end up spending a vast amount of human effort doing work that fundamentally doesn't need to be done. There's no actual economic output to paying people to break rocks.

But there's an economic drain if you fire all the rock breakers, and they end up on the streets. With automation coming for most jobs, we can either live in a low to no work Utopia or a hypercapitalist hell. Given recent trends, my money is on hypercapitalist hell.

This fits Graeber's thesis; "The book [..] makes the case that the ruling class stands to lose from the proletariat having extra free time on their hands"

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#58

Post by armchairhacker »

We should create a game like Axie infinity, but instead of making money from useless Axies you make it from writing code.

And then since crypto is bad we just pay people with regular money instead.

Also maybe have them sign a contract for working fixed hours and/or completing a project in X time. So you know, the project actually gets done.

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#59

Post by beambot »

Retric wrote: post #41
mherdeg wrote: post #18

Is this different from the phenomenon described at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_farming ? Honestly it seems like a pretty great career -- you get to spend your time indoors, probably somewhere climate controlled with electricity and restrooms. This is way better than the workhouse. Whoever is buying these things as a collector is basically donating their wealth to others, like a kind of privatized welfare. If p…

AC costs money, in most of the world they would do without and have extra heat from the PC. Also, limited range of motion plus extremely long workweek quickly results in RSI.

This feels like a "let them eat cake" reply when compared to agrarian labor...

Re: “Play-to-Earn” and Bullshit Jobs

#60

Post by Osmose »

netcan wrote: post #42

As I was reading Graeber, it's useful to imagine useless job economies of the past. Is a medieval abbey "useless?" Clergy? Servants to the clergy? How about courtiers? Courtiers' dress makers? These classes represented a small part of most societies in the past, though not always that small. In any case, it's obvious that whatever needs these jobs serve are cultural. Don't underestimate culture. Money is a cultural c…

What's the cultural value provided by sitting on Axie and grinding for hours?
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