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Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

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Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#31

Post by jspash »

bfung wrote: post #14

> Are those days just over? Depending on your job function and industry. For tech, yes, those days are over for at least for another 5 to 10 years, is my guess. COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much. It will also weed out bad people managers who need to "see" people physically who need to "get a feel" as a management metric. The only major factor that woul…

"COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much"

Is that a personal observation of yours, or has this now become "fact"? The reason I ask is that I would like to find studies - not just surveys or anecdotal evidence - that attempt to quantify the quality and productivity of WFH since the recently pandemic changes.

At work, we've had countless discussions about this and the jury is still out. The introverts claim to be no less than twice as productive, the extroverts claim they are lying and they really miss leaving work early on Fridays to go to the pub - somehow that makes them better employees. Management hate not being able to peer over your shoulder (although they have recently installed "security" software on everyone's laptops for "security purposes"). But I have nothing to point to other than my own experience managing a remote team of devs.

I've yet to come to a solid conclusion as to how it works for others. I only know that my productivity and depth of work has never been greater. So if there are any resources you could point me to I'd be grateful.

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#33

Post by FpUser »

bfung wrote: post #14

> Are those days just over? Depending on your job function and industry. For tech, yes, those days are over for at least for another 5 to 10 years, is my guess. COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much. It will also weed out bad people managers who need to "see" people physically who need to "get a feel" as a management metric. The only major factor that woul…

>"Depending on your job function and industry. For tech, yes, those days are over for at least for another 5 to 10 years"

I think for a good percentage the option might be forever except some once in a while gathering in some local bar / event place / rent a temp workspace / whatever else can substitute

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#34

Post by pydry »

I feel somewhat similar. Ironically before COVID I really wanted to go remote but was reluctant because it seemed few of the "good" jobs in my time zone were remote. They were lower pay/lower impact.

Now the job market appears to be reversed and the in person jobs are not the best. And, after a year and a half it seems evident that I don't really like remote work as much as I thought I would.

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#35

Post by vladvasiliu »

bfung wrote: post #14

> Are those days just over? Depending on your job function and industry. For tech, yes, those days are over for at least for another 5 to 10 years, is my guess. COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much. It will also weed out bad people managers who need to "see" people physically who need to "get a feel" as a management metric. The only major factor that woul…

I'd say it also depends a lot on location and its prevalent culture.

Over here in France, most French companies (as opposed to US companies operating here) have to be dragged kicking and screaming into WfH arrangements.

Ever since the pandemic started picking back up steam this autumn, the government was "encouraging" companies to allow people to work from home, but there were no firm directives.

Most companies figured having their employees pile up in the metro (yay covid!) and congest the highways (yay pollution!) wasn't that big of an issue.

They also asked companies to try to stagger arrival / departure times to reduce the number of people in the metro. Didn't work any better.

In my opinion, if OP is living in France (or willing to relocate here), it should be extremely easy to find in-office jobs.

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#36

Post by conformist »

caffeine wrote: post #32

HFT and finance are still mostly in-office. If you join as a front-office dev on a trading team, chances are you will not be remote much and people will be in the office trading.

Generally true, but working from home is also becoming increasingly common even for front office roles (at least in the UK, not sure how that generalises).

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#37

Post by FpUser »

jspash wrote: post #31
bfung wrote: post #14

> Are those days just over? Depending on your job function and industry. For tech, yes, those days are over for at least for another 5 to 10 years, is my guess. COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much. It will also weed out bad people managers who need to "see" people physically who need to "get a feel" as a management metric. The only major factor that woul…

"COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much" Is that a personal observation of yours, or has this now become "fact"? The reason I ask is that I would like to find studies - not just surveys or anecdotal evidence - that attempt to quantify the quality and productivity of WFH since the recently pandemic changes. At work, we've had countless discussions about this…

>"really miss leaving work early on Fridays to go to the pub"

I used to have this when I was employed (about 20 years ago). Somehow my personal take was that it gets tiring pretty fast. I've had enough friends outside of employment and wit the very rare exception would very much prefer to socialize with them rather than coworkers.

I then went on my own and have never looked back. The fact that I am doing quite ok means that I am productive. I design and implement new software products for my own company or for clients.

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#38

Post by lexapro »

FpUser wrote: post #37
jspash wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much" Is that a personal observation of yours, or has this now become "fact"? The reason I ask is that I would like to find studies - not just surveys or anecdotal evidence - that attempt to quantify the quality and productivity of WFH since the recently pandemic changes. At work, we've had countless discussions about this…

>"really miss leaving work early on Fridays to go to the pub" I used to have this when I was employed (about 20 years ago). Somehow my personal take was that it gets tiring pretty fast. I've had enough friends outside of employment and wit the very rare exception would very much prefer to socialize with them rather than coworkers. I then went on my own and have never looked back. The fact that I am doing quite ok mea…

A lot of people don't have enough friends outside of employment.

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#39

Post by pawelwentpawel »

niemenmaa wrote: post #24

Before pandemic I started working remotely and soon noticed that, like OP, working alone doesn't suit me. I solved this by joining a co-working hub that offers offices to remote workers / entrepreneurs. My employer pays for the hub membership. I drive to our offices around once a month, but rest of the time I sit in a room with an accountant and gym owner. They are fun to chat and go to lunch with but they don't inte…

This is an excellent example of the difference between "working from home" and "working remotely". Those two terms unfortunately are used interchangeably as synonyms.

Re: Ask HN: How to find a job in 2021 if I dislike remote?

#40

Post by huntertwo »

bfung wrote: post #14

> Are those days just over? Depending on your job function and industry. For tech, yes, those days are over for at least for another 5 to 10 years, is my guess. COVID has generally proven to both employers and employees that productivity doesn't drop that much. It will also weed out bad people managers who need to "see" people physically who need to "get a feel" as a management metric. The only major factor that woul…

> When the population is smart enough to win those battles quickly

Don’t hold your breath.

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