Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

theguardian.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 94 posts

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#61

Post by wolverine876 »

throwaway55421 wrote: post #43
SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #4

There is a suburb of Cape Town called Bishopscourt. It is high up on the hill, near the botanical garden, and filled with Anglophone old money, trees and mansions. (1) It gets it's name of course from the "official residence of the Archbishop of Cape Town" (Anglican / Church of England). It was of course a "whites only" area under Apartheid until 1991 (2). Black people there could be assumed to be house or garden ser…

An inspiration. The best way to challenge insanity is to simply ignore it and move forward without consideration. You can't debate apartheid because it's farcical to begin with. The terminology even - exemption - makes our brains feel fuzzy, confused. What is this "exemption"? I'll just do my thing, thanks. We could all learn something from this.

> The best way to challenge insanity is to simply ignore it and move forward without consideration.

That's a tactic to be used in specific circumstances, such as by the Archbishop in a specific, peaceful neighborhood. It's for people who are safe.

For a vulnerable person, it can be very dangerous: violating norms can end in being arrested or lynched - that's what lynchings and oppression are. That is the problem. Civil rights tactics such as lunch-counter sit-ins worked because they were carefully strategized and organized, and many people still got hurt and killed. For example,

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=civil+rights+birmingham+fire+hoses...

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#63

Post by chernevik »

secfirstmd wrote: post #38

There's a certain irony that many people who celebrate the life of Desmond Tutu and his fight against apartheid continue to ignore that he said Israel does the same thing and should be subject to boycott. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/apr/29/comment

No post body was provided.

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#64

Post by iancmceachern »

My favorite tid bit from his book, the book of joy about his and the Dalai Lama, I paraphrase.

A man met with Mr. Tutu and asked him to pray for the man's son, who was gravely ill and in need of medical treatment. The boy got the treatment he needed and became healthy again. Years later, the same boy fell ill again and the boys father once again asked the archbishop to pray for him. Mr. Tutu replied to the boys father "I never stopped (praying for your son). He had such deep, meaningful compassion for all his fellow humans. Just reading his writings made a significant meaningful positive impact on my life and well being. Thank you Mr. Tutu.

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#65

Post by archsurface »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #4

There is a suburb of Cape Town called Bishopscourt. It is high up on the hill, near the botanical garden, and filled with Anglophone old money, trees and mansions. (1) It gets it's name of course from the "official residence of the Archbishop of Cape Town" (Anglican / Church of England). It was of course a "whites only" area under Apartheid until 1991 (2). Black people there could be assumed to be house or garden ser…

That's a bit of a spun story. There was apartheid proper, and technically apartheid. By that time, '86, my colonial school had black students. Tutu didn't need exemption, and wasn't being particularly rebellious.

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#66

Post by kennywinker »

Markoff wrote: post #50
dan_pixelflow wrote: post #36

'If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor.' Rest in peace.

[flagged]

Sober drivers kill people too, not just drunk drivers - yet we have no problem prohibiting driving drunk.

But even that analogy breaks down because it’s been 1 year of vaccine’s existing, and in most places much less than 6 months of vaccine-only rules. This is a health crisis. Nobody wants or intends this to be forever. It’s like crying injustice because of a temporary ban on drunk driving.

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#67

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

archsurface wrote: post #65
SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #4

There is a suburb of Cape Town called Bishopscourt. It is high up on the hill, near the botanical garden, and filled with Anglophone old money, trees and mansions. (1) It gets it's name of course from the "official residence of the Archbishop of Cape Town" (Anglican / Church of England). It was of course a "whites only" area under Apartheid until 1991 (2). Black people there could be assumed to be house or garden ser…

That's a bit of a spun story. There was apartheid proper, and technically apartheid. By that time, '86, my colonial school had black students. Tutu didn't need exemption, and wasn't being particularly rebellious.

IDK, memory and a check in Wikipedia confirms that things were still pretty bad in '86 and '87.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_in_South_Africa it's a litany of explosions and killings, and the turnaround may have been in the works, but it doesn't surface until December '88 when "Nelson Mandela is moved to Victor Verster Prison" (from Robben Island)

I don't recall school in integration in '86 near me and yes, I would have noticed. If you had that you were lucky.

I wasn't assuming that Mr Tutu was taking any great personal risk, but he was driving progress with cheerful good humour.

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#69

Post by archsurface »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #67
archsurface wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a bit of a spun story. There was apartheid proper, and technically apartheid. By that time, '86, my colonial school had black students. Tutu didn't need exemption, and wasn't being particularly rebellious.

IDK, memory and a check in Wikipedia confirms that things were still pretty bad in '86 and '87. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_in_South_Africa it's a litany of explosions and killings, and the turnaround may have been in the works, but it doesn't surface until December '88 when "Nelson Mandela is moved to Victor Verster Prison" (from Robben Island) I don't recall school in integration in '86 near me and yes, I wo…

I was not lucky - the following year there were fully multi-racial schools, equal numbers.

Re: Desmond Tutu, anti-apartheid icon, dies at 90

#70

Post by x86_64Ubuntu »

Jiro wrote: post #59
dan_pixelflow wrote: post #36

'If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor.' Rest in peace.

Remember that aphorisms like that don't only apply to your side. Every time you say something like that, imagine that someone whose sense of injustice is opposite to yours is using it. Maybe they think that abortion is literal murder. Maybe it's the 1950s and they think some poor black guy has raped a white girl (because how would she ever consent?) Maybe they're a Russian living in Ukraine and they think the Ukraini…

>..Rather, if you're neutral in situations of injustice, it means that you have figured out that humility can be a virtue.

I'm not sure I understand how humility comes into the picture? I don't think anyone didn't join a lynch mob, yet allowed them to continue on their way to the victim and thought of themselves as humble.

Post reply on HN