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Building Remote Teams for Startups

vadimkravcenko.com

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Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#51

Post by zerocount »

pengwing wrote: post #24
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #18

Good article. Having a lot of experience managing remote teams, I wanted to expand on this point: > Try to focus on the employees who thrive in such environments rather than those few bad apples. You can’t let the bad apples define the work experience for everyone, but you do need to identify them and remove them as fast as possible so they don’t poison the well. One thing I didn’t realize at first was that remote wo…

Let me expand on that point: "Don't accidentally throw out good apples with the bad ones because you are looking at the wrong metrics." What I mean is: Bad apples are real, but don't ever do time-tracking or fast response testing in an effort to identify them. There are some excellent apples who will get your 8h-day deliverables done in 2-4h. Don't ever establish any system to find them. If you have a problem with th…

This actually makes sense. No need for the big survellance net.

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#52

Post by bradfa »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #19
moltar wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remote != home. Home _is_ distracting, unless you have black belt concentration ability, and will power. For a long time I’ve worked from a coworking place near my house. Before that, when I wasn’t earning as much, I’d work from cafes. Some days when the weather was especially nasty I chose to stay home and work from home. Now I have a kid, and I’m forced to work from home due to corona, and my productivity definitel…

> Remote != home. While technically true, I have yet to talk to a remote candidate or employee who doesn’t work from home. We had one candidate who wanted us to pay for a monthly remote office for them, but it was curiously expensive for some reason and he had other problems that ended the interview process early so I never followed up on it. So basically, remote should be assumed to be at home.

Just as another data point, I work remotely and I have an office about 3 miles from my house. It makes separation of work and life MUCH easier.

I realize this isn’t normal but it is a much better way of working for me. I think if others could get past paying rent to work remotely that they would generally agree, too.

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#53

Post by codegeek »

zerocount wrote: post #47
codegeek wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Work is not all about deadlines. It also requires discipline to be present for meetings (no matter how much you hate them), be available to solve problems (sometimes immediately), collaborate with other team members and many other things. It is called "Team work" for a reason. Good developers can get away with a lot of things for sure especially if they produce code but as someone who runs teams, it is not enough. I…

Yes, it is about the deadlines. That's what keeps me getting a paycheck, which is the reason I'm working. What you describe as teamwork is just every day development activity. There is no discipline to attending a meeting when the meeting is mandatory. I can always spot someone who 'runs teams' by the way they prioritize the company and piss on the workers in the name of the customer and 'teamwork.' This is why you c…

"piss on the workers". I made no such remark anywhere in my comment. You can prioritize the company and still take care of the employees. It is not a zero sum game but hating on managers is obviously a cool thing to do.

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#54

Post by Ozzie_osman »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #19
moltar wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remote != home. Home _is_ distracting, unless you have black belt concentration ability, and will power. For a long time I’ve worked from a coworking place near my house. Before that, when I wasn’t earning as much, I’d work from cafes. Some days when the weather was especially nasty I chose to stay home and work from home. Now I have a kid, and I’m forced to work from home due to corona, and my productivity definitel…

> Remote != home. While technically true, I have yet to talk to a remote candidate or employee who doesn’t work from home. We had one candidate who wanted us to pay for a monthly remote office for them, but it was curiously expensive for some reason and he had other problems that ended the interview process early so I never followed up on it. So basically, remote should be assumed to be at home.

My team is distributed, I work out of a coworking space less than a mile from my house (15 minute walk). It's made my mental/emotional state so much better (not to mention how much more productive I am).

We offer all employees the choice to work from home or rent a coworking space, and in either case we cover the cost (home office setup, or coworking cost).

I think what most people don't understand is what we went through with covid isn't normal remote work. In normal circumstances, you can work from a coworking space. And you can have an active social life. Etc. Etc. Your kids aren't stuck at home with you. Covid forced a version of remote work that was much worse.

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#55

Post by zerocount »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #49
kache_ wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>managers who weren't former engineers woah, those exist?

Yep! There’s an entire school of thought that management and engineering are so entirely different that managers don’t need to have an engineering background. I personally disagree, but I have a friend who insists that the best engineering managers are those who come from professional management backgrounds (project management, then people management usually) instead of engineering backgrounds.

There's also a school of thought that managers are not necessary. I'm a big fan of it.

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#56

Post by code_biologist »

zerocount wrote: post #50
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is: Some of the worst remote workers are actually the best at appearing always online. They’ll go out of their way to remind everyone that they were “working” at 8PM or on a weekend because they need to compensate for the lack of actual work done. One of the worst remote work offenders I ever dealt with had a routine of doing things every Saturday morning that would ping the team: Lots of Slack “@channel” q…

Quoted post unavailable.

Are you and I reading the same comment? PragmaticPulp talked about measuring people by their true deliverables — not on whether they act like cogs or "give it their all".

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#57

Post by paranorman »

zerocount wrote: post #55
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep! There’s an entire school of thought that management and engineering are so entirely different that managers don’t need to have an engineering background. I personally disagree, but I have a friend who insists that the best engineering managers are those who come from professional management backgrounds (project management, then people management usually) instead of engineering backgrounds.

There's also a school of thought that managers are not necessary. I'm a big fan of it.

Google was a fan of it, too. You should look into project oxygen.

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#58

Post by codegeek »

marcinzm wrote: post #35
pengwing wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me expand on that point: "Don't accidentally throw out good apples with the bad ones because you are looking at the wrong metrics." What I mean is: Bad apples are real, but don't ever do time-tracking or fast response testing in an effort to identify them. There are some excellent apples who will get your 8h-day deliverables done in 2-4h. Don't ever establish any system to find them. If you have a problem with th…

Deadlines are also the wrong metric to measure people with unless you're a contracting/consulting shop.

Seriously. This talk of "deadlines are everything" is such bullshit. In my company, I am looking for people who care about their work, first and foremost. They enjoy what they do. Sometimes, deadlines are needed, sure. But it is mostly about growing as an individual and learning how to work in collaboration. What good are deadlines if you churn out crap output ?

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#59

Post by yowlingcat »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #18

Good article. Having a lot of experience managing remote teams, I wanted to expand on this point: > Try to focus on the employees who thrive in such environments rather than those few bad apples. You can’t let the bad apples define the work experience for everyone, but you do need to identify them and remove them as fast as possible so they don’t poison the well. One thing I didn’t realize at first was that remote wo…

Obligatory question here: how are you tuning how you screen for bad apples in your technical interview pre-hire to make sure that over time you have less and less bad apples? Also, what level of scale is your remote eng organization operating at?

Having also had a lot of experience managing remote teams (and to be a little bit hyperbolic for the sake of making a point), saying that remote work attracts "bad apples" at a much higher rate than in-person work seems like a cop out to excuse poor screening hygiene.

Re: Building Remote Teams for Startups

#60

Post by code_biologist »

zerocount wrote: post #55
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep! There’s an entire school of thought that management and engineering are so entirely different that managers don’t need to have an engineering background. I personally disagree, but I have a friend who insists that the best engineering managers are those who come from professional management backgrounds (project management, then people management usually) instead of engineering backgrounds.

There's also a school of thought that managers are not necessary. I'm a big fan of it.

That only scales up to a certain degree. There are some really good examples of holacracy failing to live up to hype in the software world:

• HN discussion of holacracy at Valve: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9512866

• Holacracy and the mirage of the boss-less workplace: Lessons from the failures at Github, Medium & Buffer: https://medium.com/battle-room/holacracy-and-the-mirage-of-t...

There's also a classic essay, "The Tyranny of Structurelessness", that is about parts of the feminist movement but directly applies to holacracy at companies.

If you're anti-manager, a small or single person company or consultancy can be great.

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