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Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

nytimes.com

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Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#291

Post by clusterfish »

cardosof wrote: post #258
clusterfish wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think modern US soft power has much to do with 19th century politics. More than enough happened since then to completely override whatever was before.

Yes and that's why many people look at both countries as equals, or equally bad actors. That wasn't always the case, though.

Those people either haven't lived in a dictatorship, or in a democracy, otherwise they wouldn't really have questions about which one is better, as far as treating your own citizens goes.

International relations are indeed law of the jungle though, if that's what you mean.

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#292

Post by masterof0 »

Cederfjard wrote: post #288
masterof0 wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You cannot transfer money out of country legally, pretty soon can't invest in other countries's stocks. Not true. > You should not get rich (1/3 of billionaires have died or disappeared) Also not true. FuErDais are praise on TV, movies, etc... Crazy Rich Asians , the movie , was a huge hit in China for example, etc... Money and superficiality have always being huge in China (even to get married, you need to buy a h…

What do you mean when you say porn is illegal in most places?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography_laws_by_region

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#293

Post by chunghuaming »

forgotmyoldname wrote: post #286
chunghuaming wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being a Chinese citizen right now means: - You cannot travel abroad (no passport for average citizens, except for those that study/work abroad) - You cannot go beyond China's intranet - You cannot transfer money out of country legally, pretty soon can't invest in other countries's stocks - You cannot watch Spiderman, BTS, squid games, porn and many many more things legally - You have very little rights as LGBT - You…

I used to think China was some North Korean-style hellscape and hated the country. Then I had a flight transfer through China and decided to take a couple days there just to see how bad it was. Ended up realizing most internet comments and news articles are posted by people who are absolutely obsessed with China and only get their information through seventh-hand sources--it's that insanely distorted. Left loving the…

This sounds like a paid endorsement sponsored by CCP. No real refutes, just brush air away by hand.

You visited a few times huh? I was born and lived there for 30 years.

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#294

Post by star-trek-fleet »

matt123456789 wrote: post #284
star-trek-fleet wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of these can be attributed to authoritarian, or some form of CCP brutality, when moderate amount of scrutiny is applied ... > - You cannot travel abroad (no passport for average citizens, except for those that study/work abroad) This is of course because of China's CVOID policy, which is 0 tolerance. That's a rational decision of China's high-density population, and manufacturing-based economy. I do not think it…

> I have several wechat groups discussing serious political issues in China. Maybe you do, but do you discuss how millions of Uighur Muslims in Xinjiang province were (are?) detained in concentration camps [0] and forced to provide quarter to government agents in their own homes under a dehumanizing “big brother” program [1]? Or how the CCP forced Uighurs to surgically implant IUDs and undergo forced abortion and ste…

> do you discuss how millions of Uighur Muslims in Xinjiang province were (are?) detained in concentration camps [0]

We discuss that. That was viewed as a western media propaganda. I.e., no hard proof from any reputable organizations (UN for example).

> All that is needed is a search engine on top of indexed WeChat message

I know far worse things the local government did using their information monopoly. You don't need to educate me on that.

What I replied is that the OP wanted to paint a picture of a dystopian monitoring in China, that's not what happens.

> Your most recent comment as of right now attempts to cast doubt on this fact.

These are reports, not facts. I dont believe these reports, because these media shows some incredible buntant manipulation. I simply cannot trust people like these. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eS8EceIa1MQ&t=115s

> Her four "guests" are Chinese government cadres who lived in her home for 10 days every month for two years before her family fled, she said.

Well, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eS8EceIa1MQ&t=115s, this certainly could be true, but I just cannot fully trust media photoshops trees to extend a narrative.\

> But while equal on paper, in practice Han Chinese are largely spared the abortions, sterilizations, IUD insertions and detentions for having too many children that are forced on Xinjiang’s other ethnicities, interviews and data show.

LMAO

My mother, a Han people, was subject to forced abortion. I was born in a different city than my hometown to evade that.

Stop painting racial conflicts, when there is none.

The lies can go on for a while, but they cannot last forever...

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#295

Post by justicezyx »

east2west wrote: post #287
star-trek-fleet wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of these can be attributed to authoritarian, or some form of CCP brutality, when moderate amount of scrutiny is applied ... > - You cannot travel abroad (no passport for average citizens, except for those that study/work abroad) This is of course because of China's CVOID policy, which is 0 tolerance. That's a rational decision of China's high-density population, and manufacturing-based economy. I do not think it…

You are spewing lies and half truth. > Life itself is a human right, and probably the most precious one. How can welding front gates shut be protecting human life? How can anyone survive after being cut off from food, medicine, supplies, contact, income? Don't pretend zero-tolerance policy is about protecting people, it is to protect Xi JingPing who has staked his personal political standing on the zero tolerance pol…

> How can welding front gates shut be protecting human life?

No this is not.

But it's neither protecting human life by calling "Chiense virus" "Kunflu". Enough said.

> VPN

https://zh.vpnmentor.com/

> Why don't you post to your WeChat groups "佟丽娅嫁给中宣部副部长," reputed marriage of an actress to the vice minister of Propaganda Ministry and take a screenshot? You cannot even search it in Baidu, and you have the gall to say the Internet in China is constantly watched.

Dude, what is this thing? I have no idea what's going on with this "佟丽娅嫁给中宣部副部长,"?

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#296

Post by forgotmyoldname »

chunghuaming wrote: post #293
forgotmyoldname wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to think China was some North Korean-style hellscape and hated the country. Then I had a flight transfer through China and decided to take a couple days there just to see how bad it was. Ended up realizing most internet comments and news articles are posted by people who are absolutely obsessed with China and only get their information through seventh-hand sources--it's that insanely distorted. Left loving the…

This sounds like a paid endorsement sponsored by CCP. No real refutes, just brush air away by hand. You visited a few times huh? I was born and lived there for 30 years.

It's really wild that people are so crazed that they think everyone is a paid shill. There's medical terminology to describe people who think everything is a grand conspiracy and make unfalsifiable claims about anyone who opposes them.

But good luck with that issue, dude. Maybe you should try visiting countries sometime. Anyone can claim to have lived in a country for 30 years. :)

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#297

Post by chunghuaming »

masterof0 wrote: post #268
chunghuaming wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being a Chinese citizen right now means: - You cannot travel abroad (no passport for average citizens, except for those that study/work abroad) - You cannot go beyond China's intranet - You cannot transfer money out of country legally, pretty soon can't invest in other countries's stocks - You cannot watch Spiderman, BTS, squid games, porn and many many more things legally - You have very little rights as LGBT - You…

> You cannot transfer money out of country legally, pretty soon can't invest in other countries's stocks. Not true. > You should not get rich (1/3 of billionaires have died or disappeared) Also not true. FuErDais are praise on TV, movies, etc... Crazy Rich Asians , the movie , was a huge hit in China for example, etc... Money and superficiality have always being huge in China (even to get married, you need to buy a h…

> You cannot transfer money out of country legally

True. It used to be 50k limit per year. Now because many bureaucratic procedures by banks, it might as well as be zero since you have go to the bank 10+ times. You're talking from a view of a foreigner. I'm talking from a view of native citizen.

> Money and superficiality have always being huge in China

Not so right now which is what I mentioned.

China bars celebrities from showing off wealth and 'extravagant pleasure' on social media

https://www.businessinsider.com/china-bans-celebs-from-showi...

> there have been recently a huge push back from the goverment about this.

Doesn't mean anything has changed. Just lip service.

> You cannot go beyond China's intranet

Of course I know about VPN. However, The official stance of the Chinese government is that the use of VPNs is prohibited except in strictly defined cases. https://review42.com/resources/are-vpns-legal-in-china/

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#298

Post by FpUser »

georgeecollins wrote: post #225
foverzar wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So where exactly do you draw the line between "whataboutism" and asserting similarities?

The point is that if you disagree, counter the argument. Asserting similarities does not counter the argument. If I say: "Bob is bad because he steals apples." Saying "But you also steal apples!" does not counter the argument at all. It's changing the subject.

>"It's changing the subject."

If you do in fact steal the apples then no. It is calling you a hypocrite and having little moral standing to talk about the subject because you lack the integrity.

If you were genuinely concerned about the fact of stealing the apples you should be working toward the easiest way of reducing said theft. Namely stop doing it yourself and then start worry about Bob.

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#299

Post by ClumsyPilot »

raimundjoss wrote: post #33

So much of social media pre-supposes that no entity would spend the kinda money to influence an issue. They didn't take a state with limited resources into account.

There are widespread allegation of UK conservative party using bots: https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-50218615

One of the startup growth-hackers gave us a decent talk on some basic social media manipulation

It is so easy to create entirely false narratives and / or manipulate online discussion, that at this point I would be surprised if any major group of people with access to half decent budget is not doing it.

From twitter to amazon reviews to comment sections on BBC and other websites, who knows how many are fake, the well has been poisoned.

Edit - expanded the post.

Re: Buying Influence: How China manipulates Facebook and Twitter

#300

Post by HKH2 »

frenchyatwork wrote: post #208
thaumasiotes wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a Wumao For reference, the initial W doesn't represent a sound, so this would be "an wumao". (Same for Wuhan.)

In English, Wuhan is typically pronounced with a "w" (/wuːhæn/ or /wuːhɑːn/), see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wuhan .

In Mandarin, it's pronounced like the latter. You can definitely hear a 'w' sound.
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