Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS • Hacker News Board

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#81

Post by Karunamon » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:00 PM UTC

Vespasian wrote: post #71

Manheim wrote: post #46

This is deeply disturbing news. It is already a problem that people get their Google accounts closed without any explanation from Google and with no response from Google when they try to contact them. A story about Elin Killie Martinsen, a Norwegian journalist and writer who lost access to her book manuscripts this way, was recently run in the national newspaper Aftenposten ( https://www.aftenposten.no/kultur/i/8Qj1l…

I wonder whether we will see something similar to public utilities in the web. Companies like Google would be required to provide a basic service to basically everyone and are required to go through a court before suspending accounts (or maybe just some core features). On one hand it would enshrine their position in the market, on the other hand it would remove some of their ability to make arbitrary decisions with n…

No need to tie it to any specific company, tie it to user count instead. With increased reach comes increased responsibilities to society.

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#82

Post by phone8675309 » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:02 PM UTC

Vespasian wrote: post #71

Manheim wrote: post #46

This is deeply disturbing news. It is already a problem that people get their Google accounts closed without any explanation from Google and with no response from Google when they try to contact them. A story about Elin Killie Martinsen, a Norwegian journalist and writer who lost access to her book manuscripts this way, was recently run in the national newspaper Aftenposten ( https://www.aftenposten.no/kultur/i/8Qj1l…

I wonder whether we will see something similar to public utilities in the web. Companies like Google would be required to provide a basic service to basically everyone and are required to go through a court before suspending accounts (or maybe just some core features). On one hand it would enshrine their position in the market, on the other hand it would remove some of their ability to make arbitrary decisions with n…

The telecommunications name for this is a "common carrier". The flip side is that they are only liable for damage they do and are held not liable for the things sent through their system.

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#83

Post by rsync » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:03 PM UTC

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #60

Honestly surprised they weren't forced to do this earlier, Google likely already hashes files for deduplication or integrity checks, making it rather trivial to keep a database of known pirated movie hashes. Obviously it can be easily defeated with encryption / changing the metadata, but it's so easy to implement I'm shocked they didn't do it earlier. Google drive is commonly used for a backup of media or even a host…

This is, suddenly, a FAQ for us.[1]

Many, many pre-sales conversations are now focused on whether or not we hash files or keep databases of file hashes, etc. Do we collude with other cloud providers to report file incidence. Or, for people who really have no idea who they are talking to "which cloud do (you) run on top of".

This was not the case before. I think the advent of 'rclone'[2] has created a lot of use-cases that very efficiently use (cheap online drives) and all the kids are storing their warez with it.

Yes, trivially easy to defeat with encryption and rclone has a very nice and simple workflow for this.

[1] You know who we are.

[2] https://rclone.org/

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#84

Post by dqv » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:07 PM UTC

bdcravens wrote: post #49

dqv wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah Google doesn’t care about that. Spammers have been doing it for years on Google Drive/Docs and Microsoft Sharepoint.

You're restating GP comment about why Google may need to do this.

No, I am not. The GP said that it is a popular method lately and I explained that it has been happening for years. What TFA is saying is that there will be more communication about files being blocked, but it doesn't suggest to me this is a response to this kind of spam. What probably happened is a file BigCorp wanted to share was opaquely blocked so now Google feels the need to provide better communication.

If Google were genuinely interested in stopping the spam, they would create a way for recipients to establish which organizations could send files to them.

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#85

Post by rsync » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:07 PM UTC

marcodiego wrote: post #42

We need a distributed volunteer backed free replacement. Is IPFS or gnunet ready for that yet?

"We need a distributed volunteer backed free replacement. Is IPFS or gnunet ready for that yet?"

Or you could just choose a provider who respected your privacy and had a very long history of standing for freedom of speech and the rights of users.

If only such a provider existed.

If only ...

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#86

Post by jsnell » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:08 PM UTC

Manheim wrote: post #46

This is deeply disturbing news. It is already a problem that people get their Google accounts closed without any explanation from Google and with no response from Google when they try to contact them. A story about Elin Killie Martinsen, a Norwegian journalist and writer who lost access to her book manuscripts this way, was recently run in the national newspaper Aftenposten ( https://www.aftenposten.no/kultur/i/8Qj1l…

The only thing that changed was that there's now a notification sent to the user if the sharing of a file is restricted. Why is that deeply disturbing news? Seems like a strict improvement in usability.

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#87

Post by _notathrowaway » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:09 PM UTC

bvxhl wrote: post #75

jrockway wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess the question is, if someone emails you an archive of jpg files to share on your public website, will you? Without looking at them? I think that would be crazy. When they end up being CSAM or whatever, you're the one that will go to prison for possessing them, not the person that sent them to you.

So, after Google/YouTube have been aided in growth by the safe harbor clause, they now think that site owner responsibility is not such a bad thing after all? Sounds more to me that they are pulling up the ladder to impede competitors.

I belive this is a really good take on the matter, and somehow you are the first person I see bringing it up.

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#88

Post by richardfey » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:09 PM UTC

KMnO4 wrote: post #76

richardfey wrote: post #64

How is this going to be effective if files are encrypted and with no discernible name?

I’d place bets that >99.9999% of files on Google Drive are not.

Yes, but aren't the abusers now going to do exactly that?

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#89

Post by beached_whale » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:10 PM UTC

Manheim wrote: post #46

This is deeply disturbing news. It is already a problem that people get their Google accounts closed without any explanation from Google and with no response from Google when they try to contact them. A story about Elin Killie Martinsen, a Norwegian journalist and writer who lost access to her book manuscripts this way, was recently run in the national newspaper Aftenposten ( https://www.aftenposten.no/kultur/i/8Qj1l…

It's slightly more, but this is why I have stuck with Dropbox. Their only business is storage and it means they are less likely to do things like this. They have't been in the news, that I have seen, about actions like this.

Google is a consumer hostile company at this point. Unless you have a friend with pull there, or make it a big enough news issue, the little things are treated with automated hostility.

Google isn't alone here, it's the result of very large companies being under regulated on the consumer side.

Re: Google Drive may restrict files identified as violating ToS

#90

Post by beached_whale » Wed, Dec 22, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

bencollier49 wrote: post #59

fs111 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty email providers out there. Free and paid. It should not be a problem for anyone to switch. Moving off of Gmail doesn't mean to self host. It is a bit of work to tell anyone about your new address, but that's it.

Changing upwards of 200 logins to use a new email address may be troublesome. Do you keep a list?

There's another catch, many services use the email address as an immutable identifier that cannot be changed. For some that doesn't matter, but at the very least it is a lot of time/effort.