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Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

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Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#191

Post by tut-urut-utut »

meribold wrote: post #182
tut-urut-utut wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not build yourself from source?

I'm on iOS and I believe I'd have to pay Apple an annual fee for the privilege of building Signal myself and/or installing the compiled app. (Maybe I'd also have to buy a Mac or MacBook?) I also think I would have to reinstall my own build every few weeks and it wouldn't have access to my current chat history. But I've never tried. I'd love to learn about any misconceptions.

I am using Android and building from source there is not complicated at all [1]. I was under wrong impression that using own build under iOS is not much harder :(

[1] https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Android/wiki/How-to-buil...

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#192

Post by datameta »

GranPC wrote: post #56
datameta wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, burned it in lieu of Signal immediately. Was shocked how many bright well-read people I know didn't care enough to switch after I presented them with the news.

Signal did not exist when Facebook acquired WhatsApp though, did it?

I had meant I switched when the news of the new access to data request started last year.

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#193

Post by amarant »

SwiftyBug wrote: post #129
amarant wrote: post #113

Still use WhatsApp because friends, but did not accept the new terms.. Trying to move everyone to signal but there are stragglers....

Me and pretty much everyone in this thread are in the same situation: we want to leave WhatsApp ASAP but can't because none of our friends use Signal. We should just be each other's friends already.

Hey I'm open for new friendships! We just need to get to know eachother!

What are your hobbies?

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#194

Post by saurik »

jeltz wrote: post #189
rescbr wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not a library. It’s a distributed multi-node WhatsApp client that handles the proprietary parts and interacts with your chatbot application using webhooks/REST APIs. Not trivial to setup and operate, as it was designed for high-throughput scenarios. It’s very understandable that smaller customers wouldn’t want to handle that little monster.

That is exactly what I thought which is why I suggested that FB should replace their ugly hack with a normal library. But the person who I replied claimed they have a library which sounded weird to me because then there would be no ops problem. I feel FB is solving a technical problem by alienating a bunch of their users with a terms change. Why not instead just build the right technical solution?

By "library" I assumed you were just concerned with "local". I put it in quotes as it isn't a literal library that you would embed in your build system and link into your program. I honestly don't see how it being a literal library would make it easier... that frankly sounds more complex to integrate and maintain and ensure correct operation of than a separate daemon that you interact with over HTTP instead of some presumably-C-compatible ABI.

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#195

Post by mavhc »

dang wrote: post #170
fsflover wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for the explanation. I will be more careful in the future. However, according to your wording the parent comment also breaks the guidelines, doesn't it? As in "a noticeable step into flamewar."

I would say the original sin of this subthread was https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29613632 , because it was a snarky flamebait one-liner and not curious conversation. That comment was also flagged by users, quite correctly.

The parent comment suggested the company was terrible, but didn't say why, the reply gave reasons why, so was useful

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#196

Post by InsomniacL »

meribold wrote: post #133
glitchcrab wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would WhatsApp ever have this functionality? It would do serious damage to the walled garden which they've so successfully built.

Conversely, it wouldn’t really make sense for Signal to interoperate with apps that don’t offer the same level of privacy.

Would an Error similar to Google Chrome's warning for non HTTPS sites not work?

~"This contact does not provide a secure means to communicate with them, click below to ignore this warning however your communication may be monitored."

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#197

Post by InsomniacL »

meribold wrote: post #154
dylan604 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even with E2E, if both platforms offered the same standarized encryption, would this allow for cross-platform messaging? Of course, some mechanism for exchanging of public keys would be needed as well.

I guess not since both platforms use centralized protocols. With the Signal client being FOSS [1] and WhatsApp being proprietary, I also think that me using Signal to message someone on WhatsApp would still downgrade my privacy because I don’t know what the WhatsApp client is really doing with my message. [1] In reality I don’t know that the Signal app on my phone is actually built from the publicly available code.

> because I don’t know what the WhatsApp client is really doing with my message.

You don't know that the person receiving your signal message hasn't jailbroken their phone and installed spyware unknowingly.

When you first message someone using a different platform, Signal could display a warning ~"This contact is using Whatsapp and Signal cannot confirm that communication will be secured, do you wish to continue?"

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#198

Post by InsomniacL »

codethief wrote: post #185
InsomniacL wrote: post #85

Nobody is talking about how ridiculous it is that none of these messaging apps talk to the other. everyone i know uses whatsapp and nothing else, no real choice until the apps talk to each other.

How would, say, Signal "talk" to WhatsApp/Facebook/Instagram/Telegram/… without compromising its security guarantees?

Use the same mechanism as web browsers for none-SSL websites. Give the users a warning and let them make an informed decision.

Signal could also place in their TOS or require a contract signed with third-party platforms for legally binding guarantee, received signal messages will not be analysed.

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