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Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

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Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#11

Post by chops »

hfthrowaway wrote: post #4
chops wrote: post #2

From what I understand about the hedge fund market (a friend of mine is the CTO of a hedge fund who worked his way up as a programmer), especially for NYC, is to expect a low salary, and make it up with the end of year bonus. No idea how much things have changed since he told me this (a couple years ago), but that's what I got.

Thanks for the feedback. I won't be involved in the investment decisions, but will be developing tools for the traders. There is a bonus, but I'm not sure what the typical size is for the developers. I'm wondering if the bonus is on par with what developers at Google/Facebook, etc take home. But you're right, it is something I will consider when evaluating the package.

From what I understand (again, heresay), in the heavy-investment locations like NYC, it was something like over 70% of your income was in the form of a bonus, perhaps more, ie, you might take a $30k salary, but if performance of the company is good, you may end up with a $100k bonus.

Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#12

Post by flint »

What level is your degree in Math or Physics? What specialized experience do you have in programming quantitative finance applications? What specialized experienc do you have in high performance computing applications? Do you have business side experience in trading - what markets? ...So, then you know nothing of the business, nothing usefull to the developers and nothing usefull to the quant team... I'd back of the "negotion" until you have something of value to negotiate over. And it's probably not a good idea to piss off the recruiters at this point in your career - it is a very small an incestious world

Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#14

Post by bostonpete »

wpietri wrote: post #10
colinsidoti wrote: post #6

Sounds like you have a bad recruiter. (2) is a situation that should never happen, as they get paid by a percentage of your base salary. That said, it also sounds like you're in a situation where it's incredibly difficult to negotiate. I'd say take whatever they give you and kick ass at your job. You'll build up your resume, and in a few months if you believe your underpaid, you'll have something to negotiate with. M…

> Sounds like you have a bad recruiter. (2) is a situation that should never happen, as they get paid by a percentage of your base salary. You sure? Situations like that are ripe for recruiters lowballing the hires. Why? Because the recruiter can get many commissions from a steady client, but only gets one commission from the employee. As long as they can make it up on volume, there's a real incentive to be a slack n…

Even if the recruiter never plans to do business with the employer again, his interest aren't fully aligned with the job seeker. The recruiter has a strong incentive to the the seeker hired -- regardless of salary -- because if he gets ends up taking a different position, the recruiter may get nothing.

Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#15

Post by natch »

Dude think of this as laundry for your resume. Once you come out of there, you'll be able to land jobs at much higher rates. Plus, the bonus thing does sound good.

Don't talk to the employer about rates during this process. But it's OK to dangle carrots, such as your special ability to solve x type of problem if you have anything like that, something that will make it more likely for the employer to tell the recruiter "I want this one hired."

Also start looking for other offers so that if you do end up wanting to say no to this one, that will be easier to do.

Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#16

Post by kposehn »

earle wrote: post #7

You have basically no practical experience, and you're worried about getting "fair compensation" for this job? You should be taking this job to absorb as much practical experience and knowledge you can get -- thats the opportunity for you; not some mediocre paycheck.

I disagree.

Never shortchange yourself - ever. If you have a low current salary, state that you need a significant boost. If the potential employer knows how low yours is, you'll see just what they consider a significant boost then.

That increase will tell you a lot. Are they thinking you're not worth much because of the low salary and give you a small boost? Then they probably won't pay you well no matter what. If they do give you a bit better than you expected of a boost, that means they recognize your talent or indeed want you for the job - a much better outcome.

Consider what your minimum increase is and then when asked, put it on the table. Don't be greedy but be firm; financial firms look for weak negotiators or people that shortchange themselves. You're not worth as much to them if you won't stand up for your needs.

Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#17

Post by ahalan »

Fair compensation is established by your current market value. Try to get another bidder,i.e. a second job offer, tell the first guy what the other guy is willing to pay. Bluff if you must but don't push it, in your case you need them more than they need you.

Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#18

Post by rumpelstiltskin »

kposehn wrote: post #16
earle wrote: post #7

You have basically no practical experience, and you're worried about getting "fair compensation" for this job? You should be taking this job to absorb as much practical experience and knowledge you can get -- thats the opportunity for you; not some mediocre paycheck.

I disagree. Never shortchange yourself - ever. If you have a low current salary, state that you need a significant boost. If the potential employer knows how low yours is, you'll see just what they consider a significant boost then. That increase will tell you a lot. Are they thinking you're not worth much because of the low salary and give you a small boost? Then they probably won't pay you well no matter what. If t…

Never shortchange yourself - ever.

Right. Shortchange the company instead.

OP, considering your virtually nonexistent professional experience, I'd take the job regardless of the salary and focus on learning as much as I can. Ignore the money for a couple years.

Then bump up to a higher payscale, either at the same company or jumping ship to a different one.

Re: Ask HN: junior hedge fund programmer - what is fair compensation?

#20

Post by sgt »

hueniverse wrote: post #3

Salary for a junior developer can be anywhere between $80K-120K with a bonus range of 10%-50%. This is based on nothing but 1-2 years of experience and a CS degree. Most companies will not deal directly with you if you came with a recruiter. The recruiter makes about 20-30% commission on your BASE salary so they are motivated to get you the most money and close the deal (which means you need to accept it).

Seems way high for a Junior Developer. Perhaps it's just very high in the US, around here it's approx $18k/yr for a very junior programmer. This leads me to ask, what's a typical salary for a hedge fund enior developer in the US?
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